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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Tue Jun 14, 2011 3:03 am 
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Thanks Moeboid, it's good to know that some people get it. I just want to make myself and the forums better.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Sat Jun 18, 2011 7:27 pm 
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OblivionDuruza wrote:
If you think I'm not acting maturely, then either your perception of me is wrong, your idea of maturity is whacked, you have unrealistic expectations of a forum that is open to many people of different age groups, or you simply need to tell me what you don't agree with me on.

You're missing an option there, mate. "I am not acting maturely." Honestly, I don't think that's the case. From what I've seen of you, you seem level-headed and mature. But I think it's important to be open to criticism. Do I think you're immature? No. Do you need to think you can be? Yes. Offtopic, but I felt like it was worth saying.

And this whole deal? Trust me, if your problem is miscommunication, the blame isn't well placed on the mods.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 4:46 am 
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I acknowledge that I, like all people, can be prone to being 'immature', however, in this circumstance, I don't think my actions merited the comment. I believe that I've acted in the best intentions and in a non-destructive way.

However, now I see that people tend to want to focus on the very specific event and not the issue. I'm not going to bring up the things that happened any longer, because I've moved on and I don't want to drag anyone who was involved into it. That's the last I'll say on that matter.

I'm happy with where I am now, but I know I could be happier. That being said, this thread is going nowhere. Nobody is really eager to address any issues, so I'll ask for this thread to be locked please.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 5:19 am 
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Are you sure? Regardless of what you think, this thread is is allowing the discussion of issues.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 5:23 am 
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This is just a forum...chill all

8) its all good baby bay-by

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 6:09 am 
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Okay, leave it open. I'm fine either way. I am happy with how things are at the moment.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 9:02 am 
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I just don't understand what you think the issues are, so sorry 'bout that.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:40 am 
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There is nothing wrong about the forums. This site is a place you come to browse at your leisure, I don't see why people think there are such substantial issues that it must be dwelled on so much.

Relax everyone :P Everything is fine, there really is nothing to complain about.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 12:08 pm 
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I'm completely relaxed and quite happy with the situation at the moment. There has been improvement from both parties as far as I see it, and I'm currently involved in a fair amount of dialogue with different people, increasingly with the mods.

I have continued my practice of actually reading all mod posts in their profiles, and reading through all the locked threads. This has helped me get a feel for how each mod handles situations and has allowed me to get a feel for their styles and some of their views.

Nonetheless, I still maintain that 'talk pages' for mods would be helpful in allowing users to get a better appreciation for each mod and their own thoughts on the forums and the rules. The mod survey was a good start, but if I was new I would not really be able to know these things that come with extended time here. For instance, some mods frequent some forums more frequently than others and have different interests and expertise. This is great because it means I can talk to different ones about different issues, just as I talk to different users about different things.

Perhaps it would be good for the rules to be re-communicated officially (i.e. in the announcement) by the current mod team. The current rules date back to an older team and threads like Avrons' What would Avron do, and Cam's post in this thread, are quite enlightening.

I know I read the rules and I read mod posts explaining them to users in threads, but small things like not starting a feedback/discussion thread for an RP are unwritten and doesn't actually break any rules. (This was not a major issue for me, just slightly inconvenient and not 100% agreeable, it did in no way spark this thread there are other things that did).

The Official Rules say:
The Official Rules wrote:
Threads can be locked for multiple reasons:

1.If the problem is solved and that has been acknowledged.
2.The thread has spun into a hate thread slamming other people nonstop.
3.If things get so off-topic or out of the way that they should be new threads.
4.If the topic was subject to recent necro-posting.

I would never intentionality break the rules, but as I said, I believe they are slightly different in practice than they are in writing. I was happy to have the thread locked out of respect for the mod team, although I saw it as slightly unmerited as 1. a lock on a thread makes people reluctant to involve themselves in that issue even if it is posted elsewhere, and 2. the Great Houses encompass many users and I feel that each one of them has the right to input into decisions. Communicating through group PMs is difficult because multiple conversation can result.

I wouldn't say that things are 100% perfect, they never will be. I'm happy, but I could be happier.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 4:25 pm 
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I think you may take this forum stuff a bit too serious

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 4:29 pm 
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Because he cares?

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 4:54 pm 
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I care too and you know that, this is what im talking about:

OblivionDuruza wrote:

I have continued my practice of actually reading all mod posts in their profiles, and reading through all the locked threads. This has helped me get a feel for how each mod handles situations and has allowed me to get a feel for their styles and some of their views.




Reading something like that is kinda weird to me. Im not putting anyone down here, just thinking some posts are a little too serious

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Last edited by HatofMadness on Mon Jun 20, 2011 3:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 6:14 pm 
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Actually, Hat, what Duruza does is rather clever. It is the same thing I do as a moderator, when I read every post that comes in to this forum; eventually you will realize that everyone has their own personality and style. And it's true. Like Andere said, moderating is not an exact science. Some people take it very seriously, and some people take it less seriously, but everyone comes in and handles the responsibility, just in a different way...and we each have our own unique interests, goals for the forums, and ways of interacting with everyone else. But so does everyone! Variety is the spice of life!

Basically, everyone has their own way of making the UESP a community and being a part of that community. The important thing to remember is that this is a place to come and have fun. Sometimes we must take some things seriously, but overall this place is no one's job (I already have one, anyhow!) and the best thing that everyone can do is to make sure that it stays that way. Being able to communicate effectively, like in a thread like this, is a big help. We must also all remember that what works for a small majority may not be the best for the community at large. That doesn't mean you should feel bad if your ideas or your energy is shot down: it just means it isn't working that way, and that you must step back, reanalyze, and restructure. I do that all the time as a moderator!

However, the idea of "mod talk" pages is a little silly to me. We moderators are already always available by PM and several of us are available on a variety of IM services, and we provide that information in our profiles. You also have the option to send an e-mail to us through the forum, and if you really wanted to talk to someone you could always ask for additional communication - I wouldn't have a problem giving out my personal e-mail, for instance, if you needed to talk to me. We are very available and very willing to talk - you just must come to us. We don't bite!

OblivionDuruza wrote:
The current rules date back to an older team and threads like Avrons' What would Avron do, and Cam's post in this thread, are quite enlightening.

Good, I'm glad someone has found it helpful! 8)

OblivionDuruza wrote:
I wouldn't say that things are 100% perfect, they never will be. I'm happy, but I could be happier.

You are always going to want to be happier, just like you will always want to do a better job and think you should have handled things in a better way - this is a natural part of life. There is nothing wrong with wanting to be happier, but the important thing to realize is that being happy comes from within yourself, and not with how things are done on, say, a forum. Certain things work for certain people...you just have to find what, and where, the things that work for you are.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 11:33 am 
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By 'talk pages' I don't mean just for communication, I mean somewhere a mod can post general information regarding themselves. New users who can't PM can post there, users who feel that PMing is not the best or preferred option in that scenario can post there.

I don't think it's an idea that would catch on, but if I were a mod I'd try something like that to being with at least. I would want people to actually get a feel for who I am, and I'd want that to come easily. I'd go through and clean it every so often, and I'd try to post new things in it frequently. I just feel that on a forum, action is not a dire matter and communication is more constructive. But, that's just general.

I appreciate al that's been done, I'm happy with the forums, and I'm not really here to bring about change. For me, this thread has moved to being very ... 'theoretical'.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 12:15 pm 
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OblivionDuruza wrote:
By 'talk pages' I don't mean just for communication, I mean somewhere a mod can post general information regarding themselves.

Hmmm.

Well, that is an idea...but I think it's putting moderators in the spotlight, and we don't really need it. We're no different from the other members, and there aren't any favorites here. Besides, like I said above, the more you read posts here at UESP the easier it is to pick up on everyone's personalities. The great thing about this place being a forum is that there is general information about all of us written here - it's just that a lot of it is on topic in a thread. We engage in the community and its discussions, too...you just have to read it. That's why I like to advise to reading old threads as opposed to posting in the "So Lonely!" thread. :wink:

A thread or something of the sort for new members might be interesting, although 99% of the questions I get asked by new members is already explained either in the forum rules or here on this subforum. Everyone has to do their part to pay attention. Perhaps it would be good to make it more easily accessible, though! Food for thought.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:09 pm 
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Everytime I create a new topic, it gets locked :roll:

FFS, Oblivion is 5 years old, course theres gonna be duplicate topics, and everything is gonna fit somewhere else! It gets on my nerves, I mean, recently, I created a My Beastly Character - Progression topic that people could give me tips and stuff on, but oh no, I'm a fricking mod so i'm just gonna go lock this [&@%!] and say 'It can fit in the Post Your Character thread! Everything can go in any damn thread! Does that mean that if someone creates a topic called HELP ME - OBLIVION WON'T LOAD! or something, it will get locked because it could go in a generic 'Oficial Help thread' topic. Mods ruin it. I come on here for fun and to chat about TES, not to be constantly "reminded of the rules" by damn Mods! Don't get me wrong, I know that is there job, but seriously! I think loads of people think this, and just sometimes wanna smash there computer screen when some Mod locks their topic, but I'm the only one who has the balls to do it!

RANT OVER!

:shock: <------- Me when a Mod locks my topic.

:x <-------- Me a minute later.

:roll: <-------- Mod does it again.

Okay, do your job and prevent the forums from becoming spam, but there is a difference between spam and a question, or an awesome idea for a topic.
SPAM = LOCK GOOD STUFF = LOCK TOO, ACCORDING TO MODS!

I have to be told what to do at school, and I don't need that when I come on here for fun, and to chat to some fellow TES fans.


SRSLY?

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:17 pm 
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TomDD wrote:
I come on here for fun and to chat about TES, not to be constantly "reminded of the rules" by damn Mods!

Then follow them. If you didn't break them, we wouldn't have to remind you of them. I have looked at the threads in question, and not one of them was a technical help thread. They were all character threads or threads about funny moments, and they fit in the stickies that have been in that forum since long before I joined up, and I use them as they were intended. I'm sorry if I sound harsh about this, but we allow technical help threads because they require quick answers and need to be visible. We do not allow unnecessary threads, the subjects of which should go in the stickies so that we avoid tons of new pages every day. Rules are rules not because we enjoy enforcing them, but because we enjoy the forums, and don't want to have to spend hours cleaning them up.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 8:00 pm 
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First off, as the fricking mod who locked your topic (And by the way, I have a name), this type of rude ranting attitude isn't welcome on the forums.

You posted your character in a separate topic when there was already a sticky for it. Everything you set up could have been easily moved to that thread. Simple, isn't it?

Just so you know, this isn't a job. We come on here just like you do to have fun, but we have an extra responsibility. How do you think we feel when members make pointless and unnecessary topics left and right?

We're here to make the forums a better place. In order to do that, we require you to read the rules.

So, if you haven't,

Read the rules.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 8:12 pm 
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Guys, you're doing it again. I REALLY think that this is practically turning into a thread for complaining about topics getting locked or posts getting deleted.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 7:45 am 
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Iamgoofball wrote:
Guys, you're doing it again. I REALLY think that this is practically turning into a thread for complaining about topics getting locked or posts getting deleted.

Change that to discussing and that's what it's supposed to be. People need to be allowed to talk about there issues in a mature environment if this place is going to work fairly and effectively. I'm to trying to open a can of worms, but you can't expect people to keep quite.

That being said, TomDD, I can sympathise with some of your frustration, but it's important to go about your criticism in the right manner. You need to be polite and act sensibly otherwise the people your talking to will clam up and begin dislike you. The mods don't mean to be 'mean', but there seems to be a fair amount of confusion about the specifics of the rules. I am starting to see many duplicate topics like 'how's this character build', especially in Oblivion. The mods aren't trying to single you out, but they are human and can't do everything. They willing to talk so PM them and get a dialouge going.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 9:55 am 
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Tom, let's face it, your topics were hardly "awesome ideas for topics". You (and each one of us) adjust to the rules, not the other way around. And having a way of discussing locked topics? PM. It's in the rules, innit?

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 2:55 pm 
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Ok, I had an opinion and I voiced it. I probably wasn't right, but there you go. Sorry for any offence I caused, but I just wanted to a say it. :?

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 5:26 pm 
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Sometimes we must know when to step back when we are angry or upset and learn to speak with our heads, and not with our hearts. No harm done this time, TomDD, but use it as a lesson to think more carefully in the future. We moderators are here to help, and some of us go out of our ways to do so - the bashing isn't very polite!

Again:
Avron the S'wit wrote:
The important thing to remember is that this is a place to come and have fun.

Man, I must be getting old, repeating in my old age... Sure wish it seemed like anyone was listening! :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 7:58 pm 
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Sorry everyone for the spam post :oops: I guess that I got a little frustrated, and now I realise that that isn't way of getting my way. I consider it a life lesson 8) Sorry guys, I apologise.... For being a complete [&@%!] ! Do you forgive me?

edit - SPAM post deleted.

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 Post subject: Re: I’ve been doing some thinking
PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 7:23 am 
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Tom, I'm sure that we can all move on, and I'm certain the mods are still happy to listen to your concerns. You should PM them if you haven't already. Sometimes the rules on things like dupe topics can be a little dubious as far as I see it, and I know that your not the only one to have gotten into strife over it.

The mods are willing to listen, and even sometimes reopen topics, but you have to communicate with them. :wink:

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