Lore talk:Khajiit

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Archive 1: Mar 2007 - Feb 2012


[edit] Suthay and Suthay-raht distinction

Since no clear explanation of why Khajiit in morrowind look different to oblivion and skyrim (especially with regards to their beast legs) I took the liberty of placing them under "Suthay" instead of Suthay-raht and added the detail under Suthay that defines them as having beast legs.

While there is no sourced evidence to support this distinction, I could equally find no evidence to support the assertion that they were Suthay-raht (and according to the ohmes-raht entry, most khajiit are supposed to possess beast legs <though granted this assertion is not sourced either>). This way at least provides some explanation for their physiological difference until someone can replace it with a solid, sourced explanation. 18:24, 22 March 2012 (UTC)

In Morrowind, the Khajiits claim that they are Suthay-raht ("In Vvardenfell Khajiit are all Suthay-raht like me -- smart, quick, and agile.") This is evidence that they are Suthay-raht
other things that the Khajiits say in Morrowind that suggest they are Suthay-raht are "Suthay-raht make good jumpers and sneakers, but not good warriors like the Cathay-raht." and "Suthay-raht prefer claws to weapons. Fast and always ready."
I'm changing the Suthay to be discrived as similar but smaller to the Suthay. I'm changing the Suthay-raht to include Morrowind's Khajiits.
-- 19:31, 17 July 2012 (UTC), Woundedkneecap

[edit] Void Nights?

Probably not the place for it, I was curious, has there been any information/sources explaining any effect on Khajiit dimorphism during the time of the void nights? Or did things continue as though the moons were still in place? 12:43, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

I never heard anything about it and in Skyrim the Khajiits seem to be normal so I would say no. Although if you go through the lore pages you might find something but I don't think so. RIM 15:08, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

[edit] S'rendarr / Stendarr?

"Nothing is known of S'rendarr, save that the Khajiit revere him as the God of Mercy." Seems like an obvious parallel to the Nordic god Stendarr. Is this intentionally left unstated on the page, e.g. due to lack of in-game evidence? 00:03, 14 April 2012 (UTC)

The Lore page on gods does state that they are the same god. In fact, many of the gods on this page have parallels to other gods, and none of them are stated. Additionally, none of them redirect to their respective sections on the other lore pages. Before I fix this, I would like some clarification as to whether this is intentional or nobody noticed. The descriptions for the gods on this page seem more like in-game descriptions instead of wiki material. APSX3427 (talk) 02:48, 3 May 2013 (GMT)
They should have separate sections in the gods section, to be completely honest. They are clearly the same deity, but they are as different as Mars and Ares or Zeus and Jupiter. Therefore we must treat them as separate. We are likely to get more information on the different versions of each god in ESO. Jeancey (talk) 21:01, 3 May 2013 (GMT)

[edit] Etymological Note

Browsing the page anonymously at first, I saw a specific part mentioned under the Etymological Note regarding the nature of the Khajiit, which I decide to change, as aforementioned, anonymously. Quite a bold statement to be made, since it's basically my first contribution, but I was wondering, since there is no verb in the English language (desert) that elaborates on the point the Khajjiti language is trying to convey, should it be reverted back? Taking into account of course, that the suffix -iit defines one's occupation or residence, it could be possibly changed to stress out the desert as the area in which Khajiit live. --Lupus 20:33, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

The page says that "desert" is in this case related to the noun "desert". Actually, on this page, it is stated that iit means to walk, so Khajiit could literally mean desert-walker in Ta'agra. I don't know where someone got "one who deserts" from, and I haven't been able to find anything through a lore search. Vely►Talk►Email 23:03, 19 May 2012 (UTC)
What strikes me the most is, that above, in the suffix and prefix list, next to the -iit suffix is stated that it defines one's area of residence or one's work. It comes as much as a contradiction to the walker definition mentioned above by Vely here. On top of this, the phrase one who deserts simply makes no sense, even with the explanation next to it, no? So, should that part be reworked, looked into, or deleted altogether?
Note: I undersatand that *desert* in this case, is related to the noun, but seeing that we're trying to correctly translate it, shouldn't it at least, follow a correct format, which could be faciliated by, let's say periphrasis. --Lupus 10:45, 20 May 2012 (UTC)
If we can figure out what dialogue or book the information came from, that would be best. Vely►Talk►Email 14:37, 20 May 2012 (UTC)
Legoless reverted my change last, so I suppose he may be aware of its true source?--Lupus 17:27, 20 May 2012 (UTC)
I do not know if he does or not, but "one who deserts" is probably not the same as "one who lives or resides in a desert"--desert-walker is the best translation I can see, based on our current article on Ehlnofex languages. Vely►Talk►Email 17:52, 20 May 2012 (UTC)
This was based on the explanation of the -iit suffix right above the Etymological Note ("-iit" is used to state where one lives, and is also used to define one's job.) But as I said before this goes against the definition of the -iit suffix as seen on the Ehlnofex language article chart. --Lupus 18:18, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

[edit] Anthropomorphism VS Therianthropy

I'd like to debate which of the two would better suit Khajiit in the opening of the page. Therianthropy refers to the metamorphism of humans into other animals, while anthropomorphism refers to human characteristics within another animal. Since Khajiit do not start as human and turn into another animal (for example like that of a Werewolf) they are not truly Therianthropic. Instead they are humanoid felines, thus falling more under the Anthropomorphic category. A quote from Wikipedia about therianthropy: "Therianthropes are said to change forms via shapeshifting." which proves that Khajiit, whom are born already in a humanoid feline form, are not Therianthropes. I bring this here in case people can prove otherwise.--Dro'Bakha (talk) 04:30, 17 October 2012 (GMT)

No they are not humanoid felines. They are feline Mer. i.e. not felines with human characteristics, but "humans" (mer) with feline characteristics.-- 20:58, 26 April 2013 (GMT)
Two things, One, humans and Mer are different. Two, do you have evidence to support that they are not humanoid felines? Jeancey (talk) 21:03, 26 April 2013 (GMT)
Technically half of the Khajiit subspecies are not humanoid. :P And both mer and humans are humanoid so that's not wrong either.
And yes Anthropomorphism is correct. Therianthropy is the catch-all term for all types of were creatures, being Lycanthropy(wolves) one of them.--Ashendant (talk) 10:40, 3 May 2013 (GMT)

[edit] Alfiq

Do we have any real reason to believe the Alfiq are Khajiits? If the only sources on them are Mixed Unit Tactics and Ahzirr Traajijazeri, I think the only logical thing to do is move them to the bestiary unless and until we learn more. Minor EditsThreatsEvidence 05:07, 7 June 2013 (GMT)

Check this, Lore:Pocket Guide to the Empire, 1st Edition/The Elsweyr Confederacy. 02:47, 4 November 2013 (GMT)
There is no reference to them there.--AKB Talk Cont Mail 03:09, 4 November 2013 (GMT)
It's the line "while one born under the opposite conditions will be little more than an intelligent house-cat." (and house-cat is linked to Alfiq) added to Mixed Units line of "a few ordinary cats among the Dagi and even claimed that these ordinary cats are known as 'Alfiq'". While its not entirely clear I can accept it. Silence is GoldenBreak the Silence 16:17, 4 November 2013 (GMT)
Ctrl + F has failed me, darn it. :) I'm willing to accept the information as well, then. --AKB Talk Cont Mail 18:55, 4 November 2013 (GMT)

[edit] OB and SR Suthay-raht or Cathay

There is no evidence in the games for which sub-species is found in Oblivion and Skyrim, so I removed that detail for now. In fact, the info was added by an anonymous user who stated on this very page that "While there is no sourced evidence to support this distinction...". Facts only, no original research, which is what this seems to be. Silence is GoldenBreak the Silence 21:35, 15 August 2013 (GMT)

I seem to recall something about it in oblivion.... Let me look into it. Jeancey (talk) 22:07, 15 August 2013 (GMT)

[edit] Dune?

Just wondering has anyone else noted the parallel between the khajiit lore and Dune. Spice/moonsugar, Mane/tyrant, Clan mothers/Revered mother, etc. Grigs (talk) 03:39, 4 November 2013 (GMT)

That seems a very simplistic connection, all societies have similar aspects. Silence is GoldenBreak the Silence 15:47, 4 November 2013 (GMT)
A physiologically unique power-head who is moved about on a cart, is not a common aspect of society. All of these aspects I list and other share such detailed parallels, though I havent elaborated on them cause I assume anyone who read the two will see them clearly. Grigs (talk) 23:52, 10 November 2013 (GMT)
I really, really, really had to stretch my imagination to see any sort of connection. Many societies carry the ruler around, often on carts or carriages, and there are many aspects of dune that aren't seen in khajiit society. Khajiit is a typical desert-based nomadic matriarchal society. Desert nomads were well known for caravans (as are khajiit) and often as smugglers. I see no real connection to the Dune series here. Jeancey (talk) 00:08, 11 November 2013 (GMT)

[edit] Pahmar

There is no evidence in any lore book I've read that suggests the Pahmar or Pahmar-raht are quadrapedal. The only thing I've found is that they are tiger like in appearance. — Unsigned comment by (talk) at 16:19 on 15 February 2014

[edit] Bloodmoon

Is there any information on what Khajiit would look like if born under Hircine's Bloodmoon? The Bloodmoon requires Secunda to be full, if that makes any difference. — Unsigned comment by (talk) at 09:21 on 16 February 2015

I don't think the Bloodmoon affects ja'Kha'jay; if Secunda must be full, then you would get one of four forms depending on the phase of Masser: Senche, Cathay, Ohmes or Alfiq. --Enodoc (talk) 17:57, 16 February 2015 (GMT)

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