Oblivion:Gripes/Persuasion and Speechcraft

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This article provides Persuasion and Speechcraft Gripes.

Can't persuade some NPCs. Take Agarmir from the quest Unfriendly Competition for example. You can't persuade him, and he's scripted against you. If you were able to raise his disposition, that should pave way for a new branch in the quest, if the creators bothered to make one. Being able to side with your quest enemies will create more flexibility and make the quests more interesting.

After you get a hang of the persuasion minigame you can easily max out disposition of any character, no matter what your speechcraft skill (although the skill still affects the max level and efficiency of bribes).

Some people you can max above 84, while I've seen others who will only max at 60.

Bribes seem to be level related meaning its much cheaper to bribe someone at level 1 than at level 20 even though the disposition increase is identical.

Generally, because loot is level base (including random gold drops) your character will have a great deal more money at level 20 than at level 1. Say you manage to amass 200G at level 1, and a bribe costs 8G, that 8G won't matter at all when you hit level 20 and have 32,000G or can make 500G in the course of 5 minutes.

It would at least be interesting to have different bribes for different situations. Because of how speechcraft is implemented, this often isn't possible, but some examples exist. An example is asking beggars for information in Thieves Guild quests. But paying people to like you in general does seem a bit odd.

You can buy/create a cheap Charm spell which will increase any one's disposition to 100 before engaging them in dialogue or buying and selling. It also gives you the Master speechcraft perk. This completely negates the usefulness and need of the speechcraft and persuasion game.

if you feel this way then don't use the persuasion. Its very simple, you can have fun role-playing

telling that person jokes and what-not or you can cast a spell on them what ever bakes your cake... I agree that it CAN BE pointless and that spells are easier, but i also find making a charming imperial fun.

I don't see why there should be any arbitrary and artificial maximum to attainable disposition at all (although possibly it should get harder and harder to increase the higher that it already is, and this also dependent on the specific character of the NPC). Part of the fun of Morrowind (for me) was trying to get all of the ladies to fall in love with my character (i.e., disposition 100) - even Eldafire.

Maybe, but it's necessary. Otherwise, you might start getting all buddy-buddy with the population of Hackdirt.

You can’t taunt using Speechcraft like you could in Morrowind, the only way you can get some one to attack you without attacking them is with frenzy spells which only go up to level 25.

Actually, some NPCs will attack you with a low enough disposition.

If a Frenzy spell is labelled "Up to Level 25", it actually works on all NPCs level 25 and over (it is confusing, I know).

The fact that if you tell someone a joke, you have to threaten them before you can tell them another joke is flat out ridiculous. An Oblivion conversation would go something like this: "Hey, those are some pretty fancy clothes you're wearing. Did I tell you about the time I fought off a hundred daedra? Well, I just flew in from Morrowind, and boy are my arms tired! I'll murder you in your sleep if you don't laugh."

You're absolutely right, it's quite ridiculous. However, I always just thought of it as an "abstract system", just like combat in D&D. The actual things you say in the minigame are really just symbols for the general level of success you have in persuading them, if that makes any sense.

Why is there even a "Boast" option? Is there anyone in Cyrodiil who responds positively to it?

um... yes actually, there are many people who respond positively to it.

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