Oblivion talk:Non Random Loot

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Items like Circlet of Omnipotence, Ring of The Gray, Calliben's Grim Retort, and Fin Gleam belong on the Oblivion:Unique Items page, in fact Calliben is already there. The rest of the items are specific instances of random magic items. Thus, I've started a new section called "Specific Instances" on the Oblivion:Magic Items page, please move your content there. --Thehankerchief 23:27, 18 May 2006 (EDT)

And while you're at it, you might want to be a little more specific with some of these locations. I spent over an hour searching for that Ring of Speed outside Fort Farragut. Outside Fort Farragut is a big place, overgrown with lots of foliage, too. I searched everywhere within reason. (I even searched INSIDE Fort Farragut just in case.) If I'm understanding Thehankerchief correctly, these items are not necessarily going to be there for every character? Or maybe you have to be X level first? Because it's either that or the devs never wanted you to find this thing. I searched EVERYwhere. (I really miss the Detect Enchantment spell from MW...) -- TheRealLurlock 23:01, 19 May 2006 (EDT)

Okay, I found it, but only by using the Construction Set. I added a helpful hint for other people, because there's no way in hell I'd have found that thing without cheating like that based on the info that was there before. -- TheRealLurlock 20:04, 23 May 2006 (EDT)

Contents 1 Fort Teleman 2 Bands of Kwang Lao? 3 Ring of Destruction 4 is this ok? 5 More stuff

[edit] Fort Teleman

I've changed footnote #1 about Fort Teleman's Amulet of Luck, since it stated it was "sitting on the floor..." -- After spending about an hour inspecting every possible floor tile, a desperate search on Google revealed the Amulet is really floating above in the air... and I was able to locate it and jump to grab it shortly thereafter :-) -- Basophilous 17:32, 26 July 2007 (EDT)

Its original location is indeed floating in the air. But (as mentioned in the intro to the page) it does generally fall to the ground. I don't know what triggers it falling, but every time I've found it, it was sitting on the floor (OK, once it was more in the floor than on it). It might be related to the fact that it generally seems to be rainy and windy when I've been there. --Nephele^Talk 01:49, 30 July 2007 (EDT)

[edit] Bands of Kwang Lao?

I think the bands should be in this list, but correct me if I'm wrong. --outlyer 23:25, 24 January 2008 (EST)

No, the bands are a unique item and so are on the Unique Items page instead. The unique items do indeed always appear in the same place but this page is for non-unique items that always appear in a certain location. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 03:59, 25 January 2008 (EST)

Kind of thought that (and actually looked for a note regarding that) but as it stands Fin Gleam, Calliben's Grim Retort and Ring of the Gray are unique too, and listed here as well. I'll refrain from being bold at this very moment (just in case there's no consensus about this page) but IMHO they should be removed and a note be added about this page not listing unique items. --outlyer 10:13, 25 January 2008 (EST)

That's a very good point - I hadn't spotted those. It looks like they've been there right from the start and just never got taken off. I agree with you but let's see if others have an opinion about this. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 11:14, 25 January 2008 (EST)

Well, I'd say it should be either all or none. Either we remove those three items, or we add the Bands of Kwang Lao and any other Unique items that are guaranteed to be found in a given location. Note that this should not include items given as quest rewards or that you need to pick up in order to do a quest. Items found during a quest that don't directly relate to the quest (e.g. Caliben's Grim Retort) could still be allowed, assuming we allow any of them. --TheRealLurlock ^Talk 11:38, 25 January 2008 (EST)

I'm not sure what makes the most sense here. Basically, I see this page as a list of easter-egg-like items that are generally placed in hard to find locations, and therefore the purpose of this page is to provide detailed information on how to find the items. For generic magic items, this page seems like the best way to provide those details, instead of trying to squeeze the information onto pages like Oblivion:Generic Magic Weapons, where the information would just get lost. But I'm not sure where to draw the line with other items. Fin Gleam is a perfect example: it is a unique item and has its own entry on the Oblivion:Unique Items article. But otherwise, it seems to really belong on this page: it is easter-egg-like and hard to find.

I think for readers perhaps it would be most useful to include some of these unique items on this page (for many readers, some of the distinctions that we draw between unique items and generic items are probably really hard to understand). There should also be links to both unique items and artifacts on the page. But I think that unique items that meet the following criteria would make sense:

• They are available for free (i.e., not purchased items)
• They are available from the start of the game in a guaranteed location
• They are not quest rewards

All of which means, I'd say that the Bands of Kwang Lao would belong on the page. If other editors agree with that definition of the page's scope, that is ;) --Nephele^Talk 14:46, 25 January 2008 (EST)

Lurlock's and Nephele's suggestions make sense. That would mean the BoKL come on and that the Ring of the Gray definitely comes off (as a quest reward). But the leaves Calliben's Grim Retort, the Dagger of Sparks and the Battle Axe of Depletion (quest-related) and the Feather Shoes, Fortify Fatigue Pants, Boots of the Eel, Staff of Light and Staff of Telekinesis (for sale but can be stolen). For that matter, what about the Circlet of Omnipotence - sort of quest-related but definitely unmarked-quest related. I'd be inclined to keep them on. Whatever we decide, the introduction will need to be revamped with the new criteria. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 15:15, 25 January 2008 (EST)

[edit] Ring of Destruction

I just spent the better part of three hours looking for this ring. To the best of my knowledge, and I did check before I grabbed it up, it isn't even visible to the naked eye. The only reason I found it was because my "grab hand" showed up with an option to pick it up. Even before I took the ring though, I checked again and could not see any sign of it. When I did grab it up, I noticed no changes in the scenery.

Something FAR more specific than what is listed here needs to be added. If it were possible for me to take a screen shot of it, I would, but I don't have that ability (360 user). Seriously, this thing is a nightmare. Something a bit more specific is most definitely in order.

Since you're the one who just found it, how about adding something yourself? Even if you can't upload a screen shot you can add a more descriptive comment to the page. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 10:31, 15 February 2008 (EST)

In fact, I just loaded an old save to see if I could find it again. I know *exactly* where this ring is supposed to be. I went straight to the spot, and ran my cursor over the area in entirety and could not even get the hand to light up. I cannot find the ring again, even though I know precisely where I found it and am in the exact same spot.

I've loaded the same game file that resulted in my finding it the last time and I cannot find it again.

Rpeh, The reason I don't add a description is because in this case a physical description simply will not cut it. There needs to be something visual there, especially given that even when the exact location is known it still for some odd reason decides not to be there now and then - or at least is unreachable.

Besides, the last time I remotely touched one of these wikis, everyone had a fit over minutia, so I let them handle it now. If they want to be "Gods of the Oblivion Wiki" more power to them, but then they get less help, too.

That aside, a physical description simply won't cover this. There NEEDS to be a visual. ^{—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Alaston (talk • contribs).}

First of all, I apologize if you think anyone here is trying to be "Gods of the Oblivion Wiki," as you put it. This site wouldn't be what it is if there weren't a wide variety of people contributing to it. That being said--yes, we do have certain standards of quality that make the site easier to use (and frankly, more professional-looking).

Now, onto the point. If you think the description on the page is inadequate, you should add to it. If you're worried about it being changed or removed, you should look at the style guide and other related pages first. There certainly won't be anyone trying to stop you from improving the article!

If you think there needs to be an image of where the ring is located, I'm not against adding images to appropriate pages, but from the looks of it there's going to have to be some page reorganization in this case to keep things from looking funky. Keep in mind, though, that it might be a while before someone gets a chance to upload an image. Most regular editors are busy with other projects and might not get around to it right away. --Eshe^talk11:24, 15 February 2008 (EST)

Hmm. I missed that comment earlier. As one of the people that it was aimed at, I'd point out that nobody was having a fit - you were making a mistake and we pointed it out. That's the way the wiki works; new editors learn from more experienced ones. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 13:33, 15 February 2008 (EST)

Rpeh, you're actually wrong. In every standard for a public site I've ever seen (and I work in this industry) the "standard" format is the one that follows user default settings. This is because there is no way to reasonably predict how many people will make what changes to colors, brightness, resolutions, and so on. Also, most people (the vast majority actually), really truly do run their computers and monitors on factory default settings. Even if we did know how "most people" set their settings, they would have taken into account adaptations for viewing and be accustomed to them, thus most pages at their base are established with the "default user" in mind - because that's how most people see the page, and those that don't see the page that way have already accounted for that adjustment (if they knew enough to change it, they knew enough to adapt to it). So... You're factually incorrect. The "right" way to do any web page for the public is to meet factory default standards.

That aside, I'm not a Wiki guru, and in this case the above comments include "as long as it's up to standards go ahead and add a pic!" This of course ignores the fact that I already mentioned I have no way to screen cap anything for you.

This also ignores the fact that I don't feel like taking a college level course on what the "standards" and "style guide" have set forth. Apparently all holy Hell can break loose for adding in a carriage return. I ain't about to go tinkering with some mystical standard of how pics are uploaded and what your all's personal standards are.

I offered to help before in the ways I could, and it wasn't sufficient, so there we are. I'm just pointing out that in order for this article to be effective or to serve its intended use, it needs to be supplemented. Whether or not you guys see fit to do that is up to you. I clearly, am not up to your standards, so... Your call. I'm just pointing it out.

I really don't think anybody's tried to suggest that you're "not up to our standards!" You clearly have ideas about what would be helpful here, and I was being serious when I encouraged you to add to the text yourself. In fact, I still encourage you to do so. Even if you don't feel like looking through the style guide, there are other editors around who can make any necessary changes to whatever you add.

As far as an image goes, I didn't mean to imply that you should add one yourself, if you thought that's what I was trying to say. I actually can't add one either, since I can't run Oblivion on any decent settings on my computer. Fortunately, we have this fancy {{NeedsImage}} tag that lets everyone know that the page needs an image, and sooner or later someone will take care of it.

Anyway, just to emphasize this again, we really would like your help with this. You're the one who managed to find it (even if you did have difficulties on subsequent attempts), so it seems that you're in a perfect position to expand the text on the subject. Nobody's expecting perfection right away, but you'll never get anywhere if you don't give it a shot! --Eshe^talk00:28, 16 February 2008 (EST)

Okay, off the subject of high horses, another problem I am encountering is that I *cannot* reproduce the effect. I simply cannot find the ring again! I did notice the last couple of times that when I reload my save and dive into the water, while underwater I hear and odd "clink." It sounds like... You guessed it, a ring bouncing off a rock.

I've read in the other entries on this page that these things actually spawn in the sky (not unusual for a video game to do that) and then fall. However, since the game incorporates physics, and it could be bouncing off the rocks, God only knows where this bad boy actually lands on a consistent basis. I do hear something drop, and it sounds like a ring, and I cannot find the ring in the same spot again. So there's another complication. I think it's landing in somewhat random locations. ^{—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Alaston (talk • contribs).}

(outdent) Well...that's entirely possible. I hadn't thought of that. Well, I guess I don't know what to tell you, then! I've never found it myself and my PS3 copy of the game is out to a friend right now, so I have no way of helping you out. I suppose if there are any tips you could add, even small ones, to make the existing information better, then that would be good. Otherwise, I guess we'll have to wait for someone to come along who knows more about it! --Eshe^talk00:39, 16 February 2008 (EST)

Yeah, unfortunately I do think that's what is happening. I just did it another 5 times. On four of those tests I heard the clink again, and the ring was not there. In one instance I heard nothing, and found no ring. It's possible that as is the case with one of the amulets, it's up in the air, but I'll be damned if I can see the bastard to even begin to knock it out of the sky. A detect magic spell would be really useful here. I've tried light spells, night-eye, naked eye, and everything else I could think of. I can't get it to become visible. The rings are so damned tiny to begin with... This one's got to be one of the hardest items in the game to find. –Alaston

The ring is supposed to be easy to find; if you look for it in the construction set it's in a cleft in the rocks that is highlighted by a bottle on the floor of the lake. The trouble is that gravity takes hold. I found the bottle quite a way away at the bottom of the hill and had a quick look around for the ring but to no avail. It could quite easily have become stuck in some sand further away. I might go and have another look at my factory default screen settings of 1680x1050. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 01:48, 16 February 2008 (EST)

The one time I did find it, I did indeed find it wedged between two boulders at the base of the boulders on the sea floor. However, it's not been there on subsequent tries as noted above. The part about the bottle on the ground is good to know and knowledge I hadn't seen before - but there is more than one bottle on the sea bed too, and you're right - they move a lot. –Alaston

After loading a few different saves on the PC, I can confirm that it definitely rolls downhill from its initial location and ends up in a basically random spot on the lake bottom. On the PC, you can watch exactly what happens by first moving to the general vicinity, and then typing player.moveto c4a18. That will take you directly to the ring's location (you have to be within one or two cells of the location first, otherwise the game won't recognize the RefID. One way to quickly get close enough is to first use coc FanacaseculExterior). I've done it with a few different players, several of whom had never been anywhere near that location before. Each time the ring was in a different spot. And on the third try I was familiar enough with what I was doing to immediately spot the ring and watch it tumble from its initial spot.

The bottle (bottle of ale, RefID c4a1c) does the same thing, and the bottle and ring seem to generally end up in the same general vicinity (i.e., within maybe 10 feet of each other). Whether that's close enough to help with finding the ring, I'm not sure ;)

Also, my impression is that doing this with really bad video settings makes it much easier to find the ring. When the background textures are all blurry and indistinct, I find it easier to pick out a tiny circle against the backdrop. --Nephele^Talk 02:51, 16 February 2008 (EST)

[edit] is this ok?

What about this? Sorry about artifacting I wanted to keep the file size down and to get an idea of where it is the image needs to be a bit bigger.

• Image:RingOfDestruction.jpg

I think an ingame screenshot would be more difficult because you can't really see the rocks below the water surface from the air because of reflection.

Anyway. :shrug:

Hope I did this right I'm a wiki noob :D

-Archeopterix

Great image - thanks! Not bad for a n00b :p –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 15:26, 16 February 2008 (EST)

This ones even better!

• Image:RingOfDestruction2.jpg

I don't knwo how to do sigs :(

–Archeopterix 15:31, 16 February 2008 (EST)

Archeo, that's perfect. That's exactly where I found my ring the one time I did find it. ^{—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Alaston (talk • contribs).}

[edit] More stuff

Fort Hastrel has the Gauntlets of Potency and War Axe of Seduction--Drake3555 03:09, 15 June 2008 (EDT)

The axe is already shown but I can't find the gauntlets--Drake3555 03:11, 15 June 2008 (EDT)

Because the gauntlets are random loot and this page is only for non-random loot that will be always be found in a given location. --Nephele^Talk 03:17, 15 June 2008 (EDT)

Ahh... Sorry--Drake3555 19:18, 15 June 2008 (EDT)