Shivering talk:The Helpless Army

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I think there is bug in this quest. I've freed the dark seducers captain and everything was fine, but when I'm trying to use the next chime, to go toward the Wellspring, nothing happens and I'm stuck there. I've reloaded the game several times, tried ringing the chime from different angels, but nothing happens. Am I doing something wrong?

As explained in the detailed walkthrough, there are four (4) chimes around the perimeter of the room... just run around the room hitting each until the Wellspring is activated. --GuildKnight (Talk) ^contribs 18:08, 15 April 2007 (EDT)

I was talking about the first chime in Hall of Devotion. The problem was that when I've freed Dylora, I went back to Crucible to sell some stuff. When I've returned in Pinacle Rock there were only three Dark Seducers with me - Dylora was missing. When you are in the Hall of Devotion, you can't use the chime before she tells you that Wellspring has been stopped. But when she is missing nothing happens to the Dark Seducers and the chime is unusable. :)

Well, that's a horse of a different color! ;) If Dylora is missing and unable to trigger the quest progress, you're probably stuck. On PC, you could probably find a console command to progress the quest, but on 360 I can't think of anything. --GuildKnight (Talk) ^contribs 20:29, 15 April 2007 (EDT)

Contents 1 "That faction" 2 Getting both armors? (360!) 3 Map icon error? 4 Confused About Sides 5 Dylora's Longsword? 6 Male Warriors 7 Wellspring Problem. 8 Heavy or Light Armor?

[edit] "That faction"

"She also gives you the armour that belongs to that faction." This line from the end of the article is unhelpful in its un-specificness. Can we reword this? Somercy 12:03, 30 April 2007 (EDT)

There is a bug when you try to speak with the commander. Golden Saints Commander does not tell you where to go and does not give the key to Brellach. Is there Console code?

"That faction" means the Golden Saints or Dark Seducers. And in this case; the ones you didn't help at Cylone. "Armor" in this case is a helm and a raiment (like the Arena Battle Raiment) which covers your entire body except your head. Golden Saints Armor is Heavy and Dark Seducers; Light. The Shield is obviously missing but you can just pick them up from the ground. (Both the Saints and Seducers drop them.) Note: At level 25+, the Golden Saints Armor will likely to encumber you; and Perfect Madness Armor is superior to it in every way. Same goes for the Dark Seducer Armor but since it's light, you can keep it as a suvenior. None are enchanted but other than the helm, enchanting the armor/raiment is rather pointless as it covers your entire body. At level 25+ I'm sure you'd have Sigil Stone enchanted armor/clothing+wrist iron you'd much rather wear.

[edit] Getting both armors? (360!)

So, is there a way i can have both faction's armors? and if so, how? i dont have SI yet, and have been playing on my cousin's 360 (he HAS live and enough livepoints...Lucky N'wah...and i miss my mage breton...)

Nope, you can have only one set of armor from one side (i.e. Dark Seducers or Golden saints.). Note though, you can always loot their shield.--LordDagon 11:57, 26 January 2008 (EST)

[edit] Map icon error?

This is probably just a developer mistake, but why is Brellach, a fort, not a peak on the map when Pinnacle rock is? Or the other way round, as they are both forts...--Merco 15:53, 16 August 2007 (EDT)

Pinnacle ROCK could be an explanation. Otherwise you'd have to ask an developer.--LordDagon 11:57, 26 January 2008 (EST)

[edit] Confused About Sides

I'm working my way through the SI campaign for the first time, and I am just about to become the Duke of Dementia - i.e. the one with the Dark Seducers. There's a quest before this one where you lead your respective forces in battle, but why for this quest does it seem as though you switch sides? Why is the Duke of Dementia helping the Golden Saints?

Because the Duke of Mania is attacking them. The plot has Thadon becoming annoyed when you take over Syl's mantle and storming out to become a priest of order instead. The Saints at Brellach don't know this, however, so he takes them by surprise. You just happen to be a handily-placed hero with the skill to help out. The saint at the door to Brellach points out just how unusual the situation is, after all. NB - this applies in reverse if you become ruler of Mania instead. --Rpeh^Talk 10:34, 27 September 2007 (EDT)

Interesting - thanks for explaining that - looking forward to it now. Though I have to say it seems rather illogical for the game to give you the greater powers for summoning both DS and GS, but powered the wrong way around. So you get the 120 second GP to summond the GS when you're Duke/Duchess of Dementia, and only the 60 second one for the DS. Seems wrong to me, but hey ho...

[edit] Dylora's Longsword?

The notes section tells me that Dylora will be carrying the highest quality Dark Seducer longsword. When I played through this mission, Dylora had a mace equipped, not a long sword. Not only that, but when I attempt to pickpocket her, I find that her inventory is totally devoid of any items at all, including longswords.

I'm playing on the 360, so there's no chance that any mods are changing her weapon.

Is this tip just totally wrong, or is it sometimes possible to get a Longsword from Dylora? If no one posts anything to confirm that Dylora sometimes carries a longsword, it would probably be best to change the article. Even if she does sometimes carry a longsword, the article states it as if it's a certainty, and it's definitely not.

First, the reason her inventory is empty is that equipped items don't show up. That's the easy part. Second, you're right about the weapon. Dylora carries a leveled weapon that can be a shortsword, longsword, waraxe or mace; I'm guessing you did the quest at level 16 or above as that's when she gets her mace. Staada, however, will carry a longsword after level 16 instead. I'm going to put some more detail on the page. Thanks for spotting this! --Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 04:01, 25 October 2007 (EDT)

Ah, thanks for that. Rather disappointing, though. I'd been counting on this to get a Dark Seducer sword, and now I'm out of luck, because I certainly don't want to replay from before Retaking the Fringe. Oh well. Anyhow, thank you (I'm the same person who originally asked the question, by the way). --Honeybunch 08:17, 26 October 2007 (EDT)

[edit] Male Warriors

During my latest run through the quest (helping the Golden Saints at Brellach), one of the Saints who initially joined my party was killed by a Knight of Order. Just before we moved into the second area of Brellach, the party encountered a male Saint fighting a Knight, Once we defeated that Knight, the male spoke to my character and asked if he could join the party.

First things first, I never saw this event in any previous run. Presumably this is scripted so you have replacements for whatever casualties you suffered early on in the quest. This, I understand, and yet this isn't what I'm here to write about. The weird thing about this is the fact that, after completing the quest and liberating Brellach, this same male Saint is following my character around everywhere. And I mean everywhere.

The male Golden Saint showed up after I did some Fast-Travelling from the Imperial City to Cheydinhal. Now, he's following my character all over Cyrodiil. He follows, he fights my enemies, and "...HAVE NO GREETING"— as you'd might expect. If the event can be reliably duplicated by other players, this probably qualifies as a quest bug, albeit a rather convenient one. —Dark Spark 03:44, 17 February 2008 (EST)

Could be handy, indeed. Are you playing on the PC? Maybe some thrid- party mod is the cause. And.. em... is he essential/respawning?--LordDagon 11:06, 15 March 2008 (EDT)

I'm playing the game on an Xbox 360, so there's no mods interfering with the game. The Golden Saint is not essential (though he's tougher than most underlings and can heal himself) and does not respawn when killed (lost him during the run for Sancre Tor, and he does not come back to life).

I should also note that his Responsibility is very high: any crime he witnesses you commit in Cyrodiil results in an immediate bounty (the normal bounty, not the Shivering Isles one) without him having to first find a guard to report the crime. He won't arrest you himself, but since he is a guard of sorts, you have this watchful eye following around to keep you honest. --Dark Spark 16:48, 15 March 2008 (EDT)

I have the same problem, 2 golden saint males are now following me. I'm playing the PC version w/o mods. Now I can't pickpocket since I cant ask them to stay on a place. -- unregistered

I was able to repeat the incident with a new character (Golden Saints, again), which suggest this a consistent glitch rather than some random occurrence the first time around. The process is relatively simple: I shirked combat until one of the redshirt Saints ended up being killed in the first zone. The male soldier showed up at the end of the first zone. I accepted his offer for help and ensured that he survived the rest of the quest. After the Wellspring was liberated, this same male soldier began following me around. I Fast Traveled to Cyrodiil, and the Golden Boy is now following me around downtown Cheydinhal again.

This has been marked as a question that needs to be answered.Question now, does the same glitch occur while trying to repeat these steps with the Dark Seducers at Pinnacle Rock? I'd feel that would need to be answered before going further—Dark Spark 03:49, 5 April 2008 (EDT)

[edit] Wellspring Problem.

I've activated all the chimes, but the crystals around the wellspring won't shatter. Is this glitch or have I forgotten something? -Dan 9410 17:27, 1 March 2008 (EST)

Nevermind, it just worked. Either reloading the game fixed it, or I didn't hit them in quick enough succession. -Dan 9410 03:54, 2 March 2008 (EST)

You do have to hit all four within a certain amount of time, and if you dally that is usually resolved by hitting the first chime a second time so you end up with all four resonating.—Dark Spark 02:58, 3 March 2008 (EST)

[edit] Heavy or Light Armor?

Can somebody confirm that the armor you get as a reward is either Light or Heavy depending on your character's skill, such as is the case with the Crusader Relics? I know that I received light armor versions, but the part of the wiki that talks about the Mazken and Aureals describes them as wearing Heavy Armor. ^{—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Nixlplix (talk • contribs).}

The Dark Seducers wear light armor, and the Golden Saints wear heavy armor. The stats are listed here and here. You will get the armor of whichever side you assist, irrespective of your armor skills. --Gaebrial 03:31, 12 March 2008 (EDT)