Tamriel talk:Dwemer

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Contents 1 Copyright Violation 2 Armor 3 Redlink reversion 4 The Lost Dwarves 5 Major Revamping 6 Name of the only living Dwemer in Morrowind 7 Image 8 What's going on?

[edit] Copyright Violation

Wikipedia does not allow verbatim copying of material from their site. They do not allow content copied verbatim to be altered, and all submissions to UESPWiki must be allowed to be edited, altered, or removed by other contributors. Feel free to copy material from public domains or similar free resources, just make sure to give credit where credit is due. --Aristeo 02:28, 21 June 2006 (EDT) Oops, I guess I am wrong here, but we still can't have stuff from Wikipedia on the site. See Nephele's comments below. --Aristeo | Talk 13:30, 18 March 2007 (EDT)

Actually, you are QUITE wrong. wikipedia uses "GNU Free Documentation License" for all content. What this means is, well,in the words of wikipedia "The license Wikipedia uses grants free access to our content in the same sense as free software is licensed freely. This principle is known as copyleft. That is to say, Wikipedia content can be copied, modified, and redistributed so long as the new version grants the same freedoms to others and acknowledges the authors of the Wikipedia article used (a direct link back to the article satisfies our author credit requirement)."

Since the wikipedia article is MUCH larger, and MUCH more complete, I will begin the work of bringing the wikipedia content over shortly. 24.149.23.119 03:13, 18 March 2007 (EDT)

The situation is a bit more complicated than that, because the copyright license used on UESPWiki is not GFDL. For just one of the many long conversations that have been triggered by this, see UESPWiki:Community_Portal/Archive_6#Copyright/Licensing. The bottom line is that on UESPWiki we do not want to have content that has been copied verbatim from Wikipedia. On the other hand, if you would like to take the information from wikipedia's article and rewrite that information, that would be a welcome contribution. --Nephele 13:01, 18 March 2007 (EDT)

UESP not allowing it is very different than wikipedia not allowing it ;-) 24.149.23.119 13:09, 18 March 2007 (EDT)

• I tried to fix up this page a bit, but it was very inconscice and still remains a bit such. Does every instance of "dwemer" have to be in bold? Also, I hate text that has two spaces between sentences. I removed the following sentence, because it has zero relevance to this article:

"As a result of the war, not only were the Dwemer lost, but the Chimer were changed into the Dunmer, the dark-skinned inhabitants of Morrowind."

This is fully explained in articles on both the chimer and the dunmer. --FMan 08:55, 4 October 2006 (EDT)

Ithink that you don't need to have every "dwemer" in bold, the first instance will suffice, as is the case for most race pages. --DrPhoton 03:47, 5 October 2006 (EDT)

Didn't we solve the disappearance of the dwarves in Morrowind for Arch-mage Trebonius? It doesn't go into depth about the reasons in the morrowind quest page on the UESPWiki, and I don't feel like loading up an old saved game from morrowind to remind myself. Would be a good add to this article though.

[edit] Armor

Bamz-Amschend in Mournhold seems to disprove the theory that armor was the shells of their machines, as their are 2 Ash Piles with Dwarven Cuirasses on top of them, suggesting that the Dwemer were wearing them when they died. See the relevant comment on the Bamz-Amschend talk page. Darth Cronus 12:38, 26 October 2007 (EDT) Also, can anyone source the comment? Darth Cronus 00:11, 7 November 2007 (EST)

No, but I can source a rebuttal: Read Chimarvamidium. It's specifically a story about a person disguising themselves as a machine by wearing Dwemer armor. Dwemer armor is armor, not machine-plating. I think that's pretty well established. --TheRealLurlock ^Talk 00:53, 7 November 2007 (EST)

[edit] Redlink reversion

Reverted every redlink in the article in two edits! Woot! Darth Cronus 10:36, 4 November 2007 (EST)

Removing red links is usually a good idea but not always. Most of the ones you've done there look fine, but personally I'd have left the link to the Velothi Mountains to remind people it could do with creating. I don't know enough Lore to revert so I'll leave things as they are, but it's something to think about if this is something you're going to look at in the future. --Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 16:34, 4 November 2007 (EST)

Works 4 me, reverting now. Darth Cronus 20:18, 4 November 2007 (EST)

Sorry it took so long, I had to go somewhere and couldn't find the time until just now. Darth Cronus 00:06, 7 November 2007 (EST)

[edit] The Lost Dwarves

I moved the following text from the main article:

There is a document In Morrowind that gives the most logical and probably the real reason for the disappearance of this race. It explains every event that took place that day; how Indoril Nerevar and his loyal friend Dagoth Ur infiltrated the Red Mountain fortress to destroy Lorkhan's Heart and ruin Kagrenac's plans of creating a new God that would serve to proclaim the supremacy of the dwarves. After a battle Nerevar was seriously wounded and weak but he and Dagoth Ur managed to kill Kagrenac and secure Keening, Sunder, and Wraithguard. When Nerevar and Dagoth Ur severed the heart using the tools, the Dwemer turned into dust because the immortality they aquired using the heart was broken and they finally died.

The document is found in the Secret library of Vivec, beneath office of the watch. You can find a trap door in a corner covered with a rug, and if you unlock the door and remove the spell you can go down and then go to the other side of the door. There you'll find the library with this paper in one of the book shelves.

The text needs a lot of cleanup and revamping before belonging in the main article, and I don't have the knowledge to do it. Overall, the information needs to be incorporated into the article instead of being tacked on as a separate section. Game-specific information (where to find the document while playing Morrowind) does not belong. But a name for the document being described (and a link to it) is needed. --Nephele^Talk 02:50, 13 November 2007 (EST)

[edit] Major Revamping

I have recently re-formatted this article and made some major changes to it. Contributions are, as always, welcome. I have managed to include at least one image from, Redguard, Morrowind and Oblivion. As far as balance goes, I think we're going strong. I have also placed some relevant links from the Site Library under "See Also." Under "Notes," I have placed some quotes which, while not really material for the main article body, deserve a mention purely to give a more comprehensive explanation of some of the points featured. Any comments about my work up to now are welcome! --HMSVictory^Talk 10:07, 19 April 2008 (EDT)

Quick input on structure: 1st. paragraph-- You might want to state that the Dwemer are one of several races with the common heritage of Mer, Dwe-mer, Alt-mer. To say they are the Mer is confusing. Then, consider rearranging the order of paragraphs, start with what defines them, their accomplishments, architecture and then get to their disappearance. Break down the Wall-of-Text with sub-headlines of that kind, so people can scan the page, navigate, and not tire their eyes. If you want, I can help you with that later, when you're done with the write-up. Overall, good article and very informative. --Cheers, Benould^•T•C 16:32, 22 April 2008 (EDT)

[edit] Name of the only living Dwemer in Morrowind

I remember in the main quest for Morrowind, you had to talk to a dwarf, who was the only living dwarf left in Tamriel. I am trying to remember his name but I can't, and I know that the part that you get to him in the MQ was pretty deep in and I don't want to play through that far just to get a name. Could someone help me out?

68.123.0.251 23:16, 23 April 2008 (EDT)

Did you actually try reading the article first? Because the article talks about "Yagrum Bagarn, the last living Dwemer." If you had any doubt whether it's the same character, you could try following the link. You really can find out your answers a lot faster if you read the information that's already provided on the site. --Nephele^Talk 23:42, 23 April 2008 (EDT)

[edit] Image

I was wondering if an image of one of the Dwemer spectres seen in Morrowind should be included on the page (see here). The image shows vaguely what the Dwemer looked like before they disappeared.--Willyhead^/t 13:08, 26 April 2008 (EDT)

Good idea, but the images here already are too good to be removed, and with them on the page there really isn't enough space for another one. If someone could take a really clear, bright and close-up screenshot of a pasive Dwarven Spectre, then maybe we could include it, with another paragrapth referring to it for text padding and spacing. --HMSVictory^Talk 13:15, 26 April 2008 (EDT)

Maybe this one uploaded by User:Deepfighter could find a place. I believe the drawing is concept art from the development of TES 3, but you should ask him to be sure. --Benould^•T•C 14:46, 26 April 2008 (EDT)

Yeah, that's conecpt art. It's not particularly clear though, and when you compare it to the three other images we have already, I think it's just not right. I have an idea though. If we are going to include a Dwarven Spectre at all, then it should be inside a Dwemer ruin with pletnty of light. Now, there are basically no Dwemer ruins with an acceptable level of light for this image, so how about creating one in the CS? Then you could conviniently include some Dwemer constructs in the background or something else scenic. Anyway, the problem is, images taken from the CS are never of high quality, as you can plainly see on the Morrowind:Undead page. The Spectre there is hazed and foggy, whereas in the ruins they are much clearer. Maybe you could COC yourself into the created cell and find a good spot to image-capture. What do you think? --HMSVictory^Talk 07:15, 27 April 2008 (EDT)

Hmm, what about taking close-up SC of Dwemer statues, like here, in front of some ruins in MW. I feel that is more informative then a fuzzy Dwarven Ghost. Any photographer willing to get some SC of those, and some of the apparatuses, like a ballista? --Benould^•T•C 19:36, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

Maybe we could collage all three ideas together, much like the schematics at the top of the page have been done. What do you think? --HMSVictory^Talk 12:12, 2 May 2008 (EDT)

[edit] What's going on?

Check this out. It says the chart is originally from UESP. Where is it? I was thinking of adding an astronomy section to the article, and this chart would come in useful. What's the story behind it? --HMSVictory^Talk 15:46, 16 May 2008 (EDT)

How I read it is that they took an UESP table and made a graphical representation of it. You'd have to ask for permission, or redo the graphics. --Benould^•T•C 15:53, 16 May 2008 (EDT)

Well, that chart would be extremely useful if I add the aforementioned section. I'll send them an e-mail. --HMSVictory^Talk 09:03, 17 May 2008 (EDT)