User talk:Arthmoor

Welcome

Hello Arthmoor! Welcome to the wiki. I hope you enjoy using the site and find the information on it useful. If you decide you want to help improve any of our pages, we're always welcoming to new editors so feel free. You might want to look at our Getting Started page for some tips on how to begin, then play in our Sandbox for a while to practice. If you need any help or advice, please ask one of our mentors. Enjoy! --SerCenKing 02:49, 20 February 2009 (EST)

Things to do when you're bored

Since you're here:

Aside from Fort Sutch, there are some minor bugs with Cruelty's Heart http://www.uesp.net/w/index.php?title=Oblivion_talk:Cruelty%27s_Heart&diff=prev&oldid=563490 , The Elven Maiden http://www.uesp.net/w/index.php?title=Oblivion_talk:The_Elven_Maiden&diff=prev&oldid=563219 , and Steel Fang http://www.uesp.net/w/index.php?title=Oblivion_talk:Animals&diff=prev&oldid=562824#Steel_Fang , if you get the time to deal with any of those before the next release. Thanks. - Ali

Invalid Bug Report

Please can you elaborate on this edit? That bug has been tested in-game by Krusty, and it certainly looks accurate from the CS data. What exactly is wrong with it? rpeh •T•C•E• 08:53, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

Anon IP

Umm... where exactly are you getting that 82.208.46.123 is an open proxy? The wikipedia user talk page to which you linked is non-existent, and there's nothing obvious on the first few pages at google. I can't take action without solid evidence. --Nephele^Talk 05:35, 21 August 2010 (UTC)

Sorry. I copied a template which I guess wasn't adequate. Here's the link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:GlobalBlockList/82.208.46.123 Arthmoor 05:44, 21 August 2010 (UTC)

Wow!

Thanks for adding all the {{UOPS}} tags! Next time, give us a little warning! :) – Robin Hood↝talk 06:06, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

Fortunately it's a short burst and now it's all over :) Arthmoor 06:32, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

Seconded, and more importantly, thanks for fixing all of those bugs! ;) --SerCenKing ^Talk 09:04, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

yes, its great to see all thouse bugs get fixed! Jadrax 13:42, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

Boethia's Chosen

If you have a few spare minutes, can you check out this discussion and see if you can lend any insight. We're trying to figure out whether the 25 extra points are actually applied (perhaps invisibly to the console, though that seems highly unlikely), or if they're not, why not. Thanks! – Robin Hood↝talk 18:26, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

Wrap-Around Schedule Bug

I meant to mention earlier, it seems that there's an engine-level bug with the AIs when they wrap from one day into the next. The schedule that was active at midnight continues until the next midnight, rather than its intended end point. I haven't thoroughly tested if there are specific conditions under which it applies, but it's something you may want to investigate more fully if you have time. We've seen it for certain with Amusei, whom you've already corrected, and from the description I'm getting the talk page, it sounds like maybe Khafiz is another case of the same bug.

It occurred to me that a simple(ish) solution to this might just be to split the schedule into two otherwise-identical schedules: one running until midnight and the other running for the remaining time after midnight. – Robin Hood↝talk 03:28, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

Is this something that's been widely confirmed? I'm pretty sure that a great many NPCs have schedules that call for them to, for example, go to sleep at 10pm and not get up until 5am the next morning and they seem to work just fine. I've never encountered anyone (including Amusei btw) who slept away the whole day because their schedule crossed midnight. Something like that seems like it would have been heavily reported. Arthmoor 07:12, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

Noticeably in Amusei's case, specific weekdays are in use, so it could be something odd like that. I remember doing a little testing around the time and confirming that it occurred under other circumstances with other NPCs as well, but I wasn't being all that thorough, just doing proof-of-concept testing. I can play with it a bit more if you want and see what I can figure out. – Robin Hood↝talk 19:01, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

That would be great. I'm still waiting to see if any further bug reports come in for the DLCs but it looks like nearly all of them have been fixed already. If Khafiz turns out to be bugged that can go in on the UOMP cleanup I'm doing to resolve the remaining bugs. If there's anything left to find in the main UOP, we've already decided enough has been done and unless anything major comes up, it's not going to be getting updated again. I suspect if we didn't stop now, there'd still be a thousand more bugs to squash :) Arthmoor 10:07, 23 September 2010 (UTC)

Well, the first half of this issue is solved: Khafiz doesn't go to sleep because his bedroll is disabled. It looks like it's incorrectly marked as "Set Enable State to Opposite of Parent" he's set to sleep in the wrong bedroll (the one disabled by the clutter marker instead of the one enabled by the fence marker). – Robin Hood↝talk 04:02, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

(←) As for the main concern, looking back at what I had typed, it seems that the bug only occurs when the schedule if for specific days and it goes past midnight. Keeping that in mind, I ran various tests, all using Amir since he's out of the way of anything and has a very simple schedule. The tests simply had him walk out to the map marker for the shrine and stay there for the specified times. Here are the results:

Day of Week	Time	Duration	Result
Any	22	4	Went there every day, start and stop times as expected.
Sunday	22	4	Sunday: Moved to map marker, stayed till 2am. Monday: Moved to map marker, stayed till midnight.
Weekends	22	4	First Saturday, Sunday: Moved to map marker, stayed till 2am. Monday: Moved to map marker, stayed till midnight. Friday: Stayed by shrine. Following Saturday: Much to my surprise, as soon as it was Saturday, he moved to the map marker at midnight, stayed till 2am.
Mon, Wed, Fri	22	4	Saturday: 10-midnight Sunday: nothing Mon: Midnight-2am, 10pm-2am Tuesday Tue-Fri: 10pm-2am the next day (yes, including Friday-Saturday)
Any (Date=2)	22	4	Heartfire 2: midnight-2am, 10pm-2am Heartfire 3: 10pm-midnight

The last test proves that this isn't just a problem for Day of Week, but also for Day of Month. While there aren't too many of those, I'd guess about half of them span days. After you've stopped cursing, are there any other combos you'd like me to try? ;) – Robin Hood↝talk 05:34, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

Poor Khafiz. He'll get his bed fixed up in just a sec. As far as the rest, I'm not sure it's worth going to this much trouble over what's bound to be very few AI packs left that haven't been fixed. We've reached a point with the UOPS where folks were starting to get squirrly about what was being fixed. I'll keep track of anything incidental that pops up, but again, nothing is planned for release unless it's fairly major or a bug is found in a previous UOP/UOPS fix. At this point a couple of AI packs rolling over past midnight isn't critical. Arthmoor 06:36, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

I would tend to agree. It's good information to know if someone's misbehaving, but if it causes no major impact (as it probably hasn't if the only people who notice the problem are those closely tracking the NPCs), then there's no urgent reason to fix it. – Robin Hood↝talk 06:53, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

No Pants

Thanks for this. I could've sworn you'd said it was corrected, but when I looked at my copy, either it wasn't or I missed it. I was tired, and I might be a version or two out of date, so as long as you know it's fixed, I'll take your word for it. ;) – Robin Hood↝talk 19:19, 24 September 2010 (UTC)

The change was just added in 3.3.1. Hard to figure how such a noticeable bug survived this long. Arthmoor 19:29, 24 September 2010 (UTC)

Quick Question

As part of trying to figure out a crash bug that's affecting a couple of users when they attack Sheogorath, I noticed that after installing the UOPS (but not the UOP itself), I can no longer see all of SI at a distance at night when I'm teleported to the marker. What causes that? I figured it'd be a Game Setting or something in SEWorld, but I don't see any relevant changes to either, so I'm puzzled. – Robin Hood↝talk 21:01, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

Okay, now I'm doubly confused, as the problem seems to have gone away without me doing anything relevant that I can think of. Still, if you have any thoughts on the matter, I'd love to hear them. If not, it's a problem for another day...I've got too many other things to look at right now. – Robin Hood↝talk 21:25, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

That's probably just the opposite of a common bug in Cyrodiil where the LOD will fail to load out as you get close to something and you can see both the low-res model and the hi-res model. It happens most often near the IC Prison. Arthmoor 06:05, 30 September 2010 (UTC)

That could be. If I find the time, I'll play around with it some more, but I don't consider it a big priority to figure out why you can't see distant land when you're falling to your death in any event. :) – Robin Hood↝talk 07:53, 30 September 2010 (UTC)

New Patch

I am creating a patch that fixes technical problems in Oblivion like Redwave. TAO noticed it and suggested that instead of creating a new patch, I should help at unofficial patches that are already in consrtuction. He said that you are UESP's contact with the UOP and and contact you. So? --Rigas Papadopoulos 10:44, 30 September 2010 (UTC)

What exactly is this patch going to do that isn't already handled by either the UOP or the UOPS? For example, Redwave was fixed in version 3.2.0 of the UOP over two years ago by Kivan. Arthmoor 08:17, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

I know that most of the things I fix are already fixed in some of the unofficial patches. So I contacted you because I believe it is better to help in constructing an current patch not creating my own that most of things it fixes are already fixed by unofficial patches. --Rigas Papadopoulos Talk 10:05, 1 October 2010 (UTC) P.S. I downloaded the UOP 3.2.0 yesterday.

You'll also want to download the UOP Supplemental, as it has many more bug fixes that aren't covered in the UOP itself. I don't mean to discourage what you have planned, but it's likely that any of the important issues that were left unfixed by the UOP have already been found and taken care of. Arthmoor 19:46, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

I want to download the UOPS but I can not find a site that does not require login or payment. It seems that I should try something that fixes unimportant issues that are not covered by UOP or UOPS. And a question; does UOP or UOPS fix the Mace of Molag Bal and Agronak gro-Malog's birthsing? --Rigas Papadopoulos Talk 08:02, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

You're unlikely to find very many large mod sites that don't require registration to download files. It goes with the territory. Nexus has the biggest selection, so they'd make the best choice and then you can download from there. The UOP did fix the only listed bug for the mace too. Arthmoor 20:33, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. --Rigas Papadopoulos Do you need anything? 16:15, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Would this be useful?

At the risk of finding dozens more pages where we disagree on the definition of "bug", would it be helpful if I got my bot to generate a list of pages with bugs that haven't been marked as fixed? Given the vagaries of formatting, it wouldn't be 100% accurate, but it might give you an easier way to discover potential problems than going through every single page.

I'm thinking every bullet point in a section called "Bugs" (or "Bug" - I'll also track down any "Glitch" sections that we haven't already renamed) that doesn't have a followup section containing a {{UOP}} or related template.

Let me know if that would be of any use and I'll get coding. rpeh •T•C•E• 23:15, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

Sure, that would be useful, but I can't guarantee that another UOPS release would do anything about them. It would depend on whether the search turns up anything more that would be considered serious. IMO, a lot of what I found through manual hunting that hasn't been fixed isn't actually a bug, but we've been over that ground already. Arthmoor 20:33, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

Goblins?

Just curious: Were the goblin wars fixed by the UOP or UOPS?--Ghurhak gro-Demril _{or TAO}^Yes? 00:01, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

No, those scripts appear to be far from complete and workable and it was decided awhile back that it's better left to another mod to flesh that out. Arthmoor 01:05, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Master Training Bug?

Since we're trying to figure out why this happens (I.E why does the quest not add itself/why do they still give it to you) what did you learn about it when you fixed it?--Ghurhak gro-Demril _{or TAO}^Yes? 00:36, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

Which one of the master trainer quests are you talking about? Arthmoor 19:35, 18 October 2010 (UTC)

Several. The bug I mean is that you still get the quest if some master trainers die before you start their quest.--Ghurhak gro-Demril _{or TAO}^Yes? 19:37, 18 October 2010 (UTC)

TES Nexus

I know I may sound like an idiot, but can someone download files from TES Nexus? I am a member so that's not the problem. --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk • Deeds • 06:46, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

What files are you trying to download? Arthmoor 06:56, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

UOPS. --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk • Deeds • 07:04, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

Shouldn't be any trouble with that, several people have already grabbed it. Arthmoor 07:37, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

But how? I don't see any kind of download button or something. --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk • Deeds • 07:39, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

You have to go to the files tab once you're there and then the downloads will be visible. Arthmoor 07:52, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

Thank you! --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk • Deeds • 07:55, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

A small question

What does TAO mean by "Goblin Wars"? I can't find any sort of bug there. --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk • Deeds • 21:00, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

The way goblins behave if you sneak into their tribal caves and steal their totem staves. If the quest and supporting scripts had been fleshed out more, goblins should have pursued you to nearly anywhere on the map if you were carting around their totems. You could also leave the totem behind somewhere to get the goblins to start a fight with a rival tribe. The concept would have been pretty cool but Bethesda's work on it was apparently abandoned. What exists in the game doesn't work beyond the one quest at Cropsford. Arthmoor 03:46, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

Too bad. It would have been an interesting addition to the game. --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk • Deeds • 05:51, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

Dialogue Bug

Not a game-breaker, but if you have the time could you take a look at Tivela Lythandus' greeting? If you interrupt her after you've brought Rythe back during A Brush With Death but before the two of them finish their conversation, she's supposed to respond "I must speak to my husband first!". She doesn't, and instead goes straight for the "Oh! I don't know how to thank you!" line. It's as if the GetQuestVariable condition isn't being checked. Any idea why this could be happening? rpeh •T•C•E• 18:08, 5 December 2010 (UTC)

It should not be possible to interrupt the conversation immediately, but only after the line "Come, you must need food and rest" is spoken. The variable being checked in the CS is the MS14.Talking variable, but Tivela probably should be checking against the MS14.DoneTalking variable instead in order to allow her conversation with Rythe to complete. MS14.DoneTalking isn't set until Rythe delivers his last line in their conversation. 66.218.49.10 04:08, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

The above response was me. Silly login cookies. Arthmoor 05:16, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

Yes, I know. Krusty and I were discussing this in IRC and that was what I was telling him. The trouble is that it doesn't happen like that: if you talk to her at any point after stage 80 is set (ie, you've returned to the house) she goes into the "Oh!" line - that's why I asked you about it, because I couldn't work out the bug. Both of us tested it; Krusty on his XBox and me on my PC. rpeh •T•C•E• 10:58, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

The only thing I can figure in that case is that the variable has already been set and as a result it goes into the "Oh!" response. You should be able to check that immediately after she starts talking. Interrupt them, then sqv ms14 to see the state of the variables. If Talking is 4, then that's why it's doing that. If it's not, then it isn't being checked which would be an engine bug. Arthmoor 18:41, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

Before they start talking, it's 0 but then increases (as it should) as they talk. However, if you ever interrupt them, it immediately jumps to 4 so you get the "Oh!" line. It looks like the engine evaluates the whole dialogue chain if a conversation is interrupted, which I suppose makes sense because otherwise you could get a lot of scripts failing to execute simply by hitting somebody at the right time. rpeh •T•C•E• 18:56, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

That sounds about right then. Conversation is likely handled the same way as calling on an individual topic via script. Once you interrupt it, the game considers the audio delay to have passed. Arthmoor 19:39, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

Deetsan

Hey there! I noticed you tweaked Deetsan's bug description here and was just wondering if you could expand a bit more. While I was creating my own mod to fix her terrible AI, I noticed the beds in the basement don't have the "Persistent Reference" box checked which enables an NPC to sleep in them, if I'm not mistaken. Are you saying that even if that box was checked, Deetsan wouldn't sleep there because the reference for the sleep package is a bed in the CheydinhalMagesGuild cell, so she simply won't bother to check the basement? Just out of curiosity what is the UOPS fix? Cheers. --SerCenKing ^Talk 11:12, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

The beds don't need the persistent flag. If you set the AI to go to sleep inside a cell, NPCs will pick whichever bed is available regardless of it being persistent or not. In a situation like that if you don't want them using one or more of those beds, they need to have ownership set to someone other than the NPC. The UOPS fixed the issue by giving her a new AI pack to sleep in the basement. Arthmoor 18:41, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

Right, got that! Thanks a lot :) --SerCenKing ^Talk 18:50, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

Aryarie

Me again. Sorry to bother, you but could check if S'drassa's and my own understanding of the problem here (randomvar not working properly) is correct and whether the UOPS addresses this? Cheers. --SerCenKing ^Talk 22:22, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

Missed this before. The AI pack usage of the variable is correct. However, GameHour is not an integer value. It's a float value, so it's virtually impossible that it will ever be precisely 0 or precisely 22 in order for the random percentage to get chosen. That's why her package defaults to the top one. The variable is essentially always 0. The UOPS will be addressing this on the next update. Arthmoor 11:46, 23 January 2011 (UTC)

Shrooms on shrooms

I don't know if you're still releasing patches, but if you are, I just came across a Steel Blue Entoloma that was floating significantly off the ground, even with the patch. It's in Wilderness -5,24 at position -20480 98417 9087 (or rather, that's the position I was at when standing right next to it). It's possible it was overridden back to default by a mod, but I can't imagine that being overridden by anything I have installed.

Oh, and there's two more together in -5,26 at -16748, 106551, 13484. – Robin Hood↝talk 09:50, 23 January 2011 (UTC)

I can't find any of these. I've checked all the Steel Blue Entolomas in -5,24 and -5,26 and none of them are floating in the current UOP/UOPS. Something you're using has probably overridden it. It could be nothing more than a dirty edit. Arthmoor 11:46, 23 January 2011 (UTC)

I hadn't reinstalled either the CS or TES4Edit since doing a clean install of Windows 7, but I'll reinstall them and see if I can find the source of the problem. If I find anything relevant to the UOP, I'll let you know. Sorry to have bothered you with it...if I'd more strongly suspected it was a mod, I would've tracked it down myself in the first place. – Robin Hood↝talk 00:33, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

Yup, my bad, sorry. It wasn't the mushrooms that were floating, it was the ground that was sinking. :) It seems that the Lush Woodlands component of the Unique Landscapes Compilation altered the landscape and failed to correct anything but the rocks. That's a new mod for me, and I'd forgotten I'd installed it. – Robin Hood↝talk 01:20, 24 January 2011 (UTC)

Your attention, please?

Hey Arthmoor! I would like to point your attention towards this talkpage, hoping that you can come up with a few answers. Oh, and I apologize beforehand for repeatedly stating "UOP" when it is, in fact, the UOPS I'm talking about. --Krusty 10:24, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

USKP Dialogue Issue

Hi Arthmoor. Since the 1.6 beta (I think that's when it started), I've been noticing certain dialogue audio not playing in-game. Sometimes, the captions show and after the appropriate amount of time, the next caption in sequence shows, etc.; other times, it's dialogue-breaking and nothing plays after the faulty line. The reason I'm bringing this to you is that it appears to be the USKP that's causing the issue—if I disable it, everything works fine. For additional confirmation, I looked in the CK, and every line that was faulty was also one that was modified by the USKP. So far, the problematic lines I've discovered are:

• The Jagged Crown (CW02B), Ulfric, "Damn him - that old bear was right! Did you run into any trouble?"
• Message to Whiterun (CW03), Ulfric, "You're certain we're ready?"
• Salty Sea-Dogs (FreeformShipsDawnstar), Captain Wayfinder, "That's the first bit of good news I've had since I set sail a year ago."

Any idea what's going on? Thanks! – Robin Hood↝talk 06:23, 4 June 2012 (UTC)

No idea, reports of this are only just now starting to surface and none of us has had a chance to investigate it more closely. If it turns out edited dialogue in the USKP is doing this, it by definition means ALL mods editing vanilla dialogue will do this as well. It wouldn't surprise me one bit considering that there's a new subrecord introduced by Patch 1.6 that the CK hasn't been updated to support yet.

It'll be a high price to pay for having our precious navmeshes fixed though. Arthmoor 08:37, 4 June 2012 (UTC)

Yeah, I figured it wasn't likely to be just the USKP. Hopefully, an updated CK is on the way...I can't imagine they put the new subrecords in there by-hand. – Robin Hood↝talk 20:54, 4 June 2012 (UTC)

USKP Fixes

Hey, Arthmoor. Thanks for adding the USKP fixes to the wiki. If you'd like a list of all the unfixed bug reports, just let me know. With the system we have in place, the confirmed bugs are probably the most important, since they've been noted by at least two people. We also have those that are marked as needing verification (i.e., seems more likely to be a one-off) and those that aren't marked as either. I can include or exclude any of those at will, so whatever works best for you. – Robin Hood↝talk 08:58, 15 December 2012 (GMT)

Sure, that could be useful. I can't promise results though. There's an awful lot of quests with huge bug sections that just don't seem possible, so it'll all end up having to go through verification at some point. I also wouldn't mind seeing the remaining issues for Oblivion stuff too. Arthmoor (talk) 09:13, 15 December 2012 (GMT)

Okay, I just sent it to the address I have on file for you. Can't send it through the wiki because the wiki doesn't support file attachments. If you don't get it, just send me a wiki/regular e-mail from your current address and I'll re-send. – Robin Hood↝talk 22:36, 15 December 2012 (GMT)

Some respawn bugs

Hi Arthmoor, glad to see someone with outstanding skills here. I need your help, we've got a annoying problem here. May I have you take a look? Thanks very much~ Dreamshadow (talk) 05:44, 9 April 2013 (GMT)

Autopatrolled User

Congratulations on your successful nomination to become an Autopatrolled User! ~ Dwarfmp (talk) 03:47, 25 April 2013 (GMT)

Congrats, Arthmoor! – Robin Hood  ^(talk) 18:38, 25 April 2013 (GMT)

Congrats! --Xyzzy ^Talk 23:48, 25 April 2013 (GMT)