Oblivion talk:Hermaeus Mora

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[edit] Arena souls

I tried using Hermaeus Mora's Soul Trap on guys in the Arena, but they seemed to be immune to it, contrary to the tip on the article suggesting that one collect the souls for this quest in the Arena. If anyone can confirm, then they should remove that from the article.


For some reason I can't start the quest I've done everything the guide says as requirements. So whats wrong?

For some reason I can not seem to capture an orc soul, I am guessing this has to do with their magicka resistance, any input?

Pretty sure that is a bug, I got this with the Khajiit once. I fixed it by loading an old save and doing it all over again. --Cyjoki 00:13, 11 May 2006 (EDT)

Err, is it Hermaeus More or Hermaeus Mora? And I didn't even started the quest yet sorry. (anyone who posted the message above wasn't me)--Thaimodz 06:04, 30 April 2006 (EDT)

Isnt is Hermaeus Mora? I was just playing and thats what I saw. --Cyjoki 23:14, 11 May 2006 (EDT)
I sent the Site Owner an email to try to get it fixed. --Cyjoki 22:33, 16 May 2006 (EDT)
You know you can just move the page yourself to fix the name? Moving it now anyway... — EndarethTalk 23:17, 16 May 2006 (EDT)
Nope, didn't know that. Fairly new to wiki, you see. Thanks for the information and thanks for fixing it. --Cyjoki 23:33, 16 May 2006 (EDT)

Hm, i was pretty sure that The Path of Steel granted a +10 Endurance bonus rather than speed, and it was the Path of Shadows which gave the +10 Speed bonus, can anyone clarify this? LeifHawk 14:02, 10 May 2006 (EDT)

I added a bug, and consolidated all of them at the bottom of the page. --Cyjoki 00:13, 11 May 2006 (EDT)

[edit] Requirements?

Must you be *exactly* at the point in the main quest where Martin asks for an artifact? --Turns out that no, you needn't be exactly there. I had completed the main plotline and was able to get the quest.

It states that one must be "at least" to the artifact stage. That means any point after works too.

[edit] Deleted Text

I moved this note here from the main page; it needs to be rewritten to not be in first person and also needs confirmation of what allowed the quest to be started. --Nephele 22:08, 3 December 2006 (EST)

Note: I was adamante I would not be able to start this quest (having read various walkthroughs saying that i needed to complete all the other Daedric quests first), as the infamous Clavicus Vile quest glitch had happened, meaning that i was unable to complete it, however, whilst exploring the bandit infested fort Cedrian (and still not having found a Clavicus quest fix), i was approached and given a message alowing me to start hermaeus mora's quest. Not sure if this was a bug or a scripting error but it meant that I could complete this quest despite the annoying glitch from Clavicus.

[edit] Completing Other Daedric Quests

It is NOT imperative for the player to have had completed all of the other 14 daedric quests as myself among others, have been able to trigger the quest start whilst not being able to workaround the Clavicus Vile quest glitch. The frequency of this happening to various people has, for me, become to high for it to be a coincidental scripting error. Although open to debate i stand by the fact (having seen it twice removed from this page) that Hermaeus Mora's quest is in fact possible without the completions of the other daedric Lords.

I'd like to understand more clearly what exactly is happening here, instead of just having an ambiguous comment that the quest can sometimes be triggered without doing the requirements. In several other cases, it's been possible to work out enough of the details to provide readers with some concrete tips about what to do (or not to do) to deal with a bug. I'd like to see if that's possible, in this case, too.

I've changed the notes to provide some more details on what the requirements are according to the Construction Set. In particular, in most cases failing the quest still counts as a "completed" quest. So Clavicus Vile counts whether you give him Umbra or whether you tell him that you're keeping it yourself. But it's not obvious how you should be able to get to Hermaeus Mora's quest without either successfully completing the other quests or officially failing them. Before starting Hermaeus Mora, a counter ("DAHermaeusMora.questcount") must be set to 14: each Daedric quest increments that counter by 1 when completed. So either Clavicus Vile's quest has indeed incremented the counter, or somehow another quest is being counted twice (which would be just as hard to understand). (And I checked these scripts both in the unpatched and in the patched version of the game; there's no change).

Also, I did a series of tests in game of the requirements before starting Hermaeus Mora's quest myself. Based on my tests, the listed requirements on this page are accurate. In particular, if I went to Hermaeus Mora's shrine with Umbra but without having returned to Clavicus Vile's shrine, I could not start the quest. But just by going back to Clavicus Vile's shrine, doing either dialogue option, then returning to Hermaeus Mora, the requirements were met. So I definitely had to finish that quest to proceed.

To figure out what's going on here, it would be useful to have more details on what exactly is meant by "not being able to workaround the Clavicus Vile quest glitch". Do you mean that the Clavicus Vile quest is still listed as an active quest? If so, what was the last quest update that you received?

--Nephele 03:11, 11 February 2007 (EST)

[edit] Unattainable Race Bug

I had run into the bug where you can't trap the soul of certain races (argonian, breton, and dunmer for me) and I noticed it too late to recover so I've been trying to capture them anyway, and I think I found a workaround. Casting the spell on a target I know it will work on (I test them all by casting it twice to see if it tells me they're already affected, then wait an hour for it to wear off) then casting it on another target it hasn't worked on previously does not give me the "You may only trap one..." message, but casting it on them again gives the "This person is already..." message. After killing them I gain their soul for the quest. I've reproduced the effect several times. Could anyone else confirm this? -- Thruen

[edit] The Bugs

I'm being bitten badly by the bugs in this spell on a PS3 and I would really love to be able to figure out how to work around them. The various methods outlined seem to not help at all. In the end it just seems to be very arbitrary and fickle, I'll need to kill a lot of NPCs to get my ten souls. Restoring from a saved game before I started this quest is not a real solution, it just means I have to go through the pain again and again until it works.

Let me get this straight, if you cast the spell on two NPCs within two minutes, it breaks and the fix is to cast it on two NPCs within two minutes? How do I tell that it has failed due to the bug, so that I don't end up triggering the bug while trying to fix it? Could it fail due to magic resistance? Could it fail because I can't tell the difference between bosmer and altmer, and I already have an altmer? Could it fail if I'm not lucky enough? Does it make any difference if I killed (captured or not) the previous NPC it was cast on?

Basically I'm not getting any feedback from the spell that will help determine what is going wrong. I kill lots of NPCs of the races that I still don't have. I cast it on inanimate objects or already captured races every now and then to try to fix the bug. I get no feedback when casting it on races I have already. I get no feedback when casting it twice on the same NPC. It appears that it's just an extremely unreliable spell, I'll only capture a soul when it damn well feels like it. I'm spending all day killing NPCs in the hopes that I might get a soul.

So far I have captured breton, altmer, khajiit, nord, and redguard. I had managed to capture a bosmer, but I needed to revert to a saved game for other reasons and have not managed a bosmer since. Or I have only killed altmers since, I don't know, I can't tell the difference.

I hope that someone with a PC and access to the construction set and console might be able to sort out the hopelessness that is this bug ridden spell and shed some more light on it for us all. Onefang 07:40, 5 June 2007 (EDT)

I'm working on trying to figure out the scripting for this quest, but I need to do some more testing to be sure of some of the details. In the meantime, I thought I'd give you some answers to some of the other questions. I hit this bug right away when I did this quest, so I know it can be frustrating, but I also know that it's possible to finish the quest with the bug.
  • Yes, this spell is very bad about giving you feedback about what happened, and that in and of itself is the main reason why this bug is so annoying to deal with
  • The spell will not fail based upon luck or magic resistances. However, it will fail if you happen to cast it at nothing instead of casting it at a target (which is kind of like real-life luck, instead of in-game luck)
  • The spell will fail (i.e., do nothing, without telling you why) if it takes you more than 2 minutes to kill your target, from the time you first cast the spell. So weaken your targets to the point where you can kill them in one or two hits, then cast the spell. If you need to, set the difficulty slider to minimum so you can kill them as quickly as possible.
  • The spell will fail (i.e., do nothing, without telling you why) if you kill a NPC of a race that you have already captured. To deal with that, you can take steps to make absolutely sure that you know the target's race.
    • If it's a named NPC, pull up the NPC's page on this site and see what the race is
    • For unnamed NPCs, focus on the ones listed at Souls of all Races. So if your target is a necromancer, conjurer, or marauder battlemage, then there's no chance he's a bosmer, because NPC spellcasters are never bosmers; if he's an elf, then he's an altmer. Bandit bowmen are your best chance for bosmers. Track down marauders, because a lot of your missing races are found as marauders.
  • Whether or not you killed the last target doesn't matter... just be sure to wait the full two minutes until the last spell cast has expired.
  • One way to maximize your chances of getting around the bug is to find two NPCs, both of whom are of races that you need to capture. Cast the spell on one of the NPCs, then immediately cast it on the second NPC, and kill them both (be sure to kill them in less than two minutes!) If you're bugged, you'll get the second NPC's soul; if you're not bugged, you'll get the first NPC's soul. Either way, you get a soul you need, and (if they're different races) you can even figure out from the quest update message whether or not you really are bugged.
Hopefully some of that info helps. And also I'll spend some more time messing with the scripting to figure out more definitively what happens once you have the bug. --NepheleTalk 23:12, 5 June 2007 (EDT)

[edit] Can't start quest

I'm level 29, I've completed all of the other Daedric quests, and I've already sacrificed an artifact in the main quest, yet Ri'Jirr still tells me I have not followed the required path. Nor do I encounter Casta Flavus. Could there be a requirement that was never noticed or am I experiencing some kind of glitch? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 75.68.134.170 (talk • contribs).

Did you successfully complete Malacath and Namira's quests? If you don't finish those quests the right way then you will never be able to qualify to do Hermaeus Mora's quest (see Notes). --NepheleTalk 22:35, 21 June 2007 (EDT)
  • Sorry, I just realized I didn't do the Molag Bal quest. For some reason I keep mixing that up with the Malacth quest. Maybe because they both reward you with blunt weapons or something.--75.68.134.170 00:40, 22 June 2007 (EDT)

[edit] Pronunciation

How do you pronounce Hermaeus Mora?--GJPal 13:12, 23 July 2007 (EDT)

I don't know the proper pronunciation symbols but a rough guide would be "Her-may-us More-Ah". --RpehTalk 06:03, 24 July 2007 (EDT)

[edit] Bug Fixed?

This bug is fixed in the Xbox 360 version with the 1.2.1 patch. If you cast the spell on the same character twice, and it will give you a message stating the spell has already been cast. If you cast it on another character immediately after capturing a soul, it will still work properly.

This note was added to the bugs section, but I can find no evidence this is true. First, I know for sure that the bug occurs on Xbox 360 with with 1.1.511 patch because it happened to me. Second, there have been absolutely no changes to any of the scripts related to Hermaeus Mora with any of the subsequent patches. So there is no way for the bug to have been fixed. If you happened to get away once with casting the spell twice on the same NPC, just consider yourself lucky. But I'd want a lot more evidence than a single example before I'd even be willing to spend the time double checking it myself on my Xbox. --NepheleTalk 11:44, 1 August 2007 (EDT)

If this is a new patch as of the last couple of days then I don't know. At the forums we still will get a person complaining about this exact bug every once in a while, about 90% of them are Xbox 360 users. So unless bethesda says that the bug is fixed and that no more people have had it happen I wouldn't say that its fixed.--Most Honored Listener 12:41, 1 August 2007 (EDT)
Thanks for the feedback! That was my impression, too. The note mentions the 1.2.1 patch, which is the one released on April 30th, so I don't think the note is claiming that there's a new patch (and there also haven't been any new Xbox patches released... getting patches to Xbox live is a pretty big ordeal, so it's not something that could happen overnight without any advance warning). --NepheleTalk 13:01, 1 August 2007 (EDT)

[edit] Soul Trap Bug

Comment moved from main article --Eshetalk13:40, 5 October 2007 (EDT)

!!!!!! ON PS3 Version !!!!!! (if your experiencing the "bug") If you cast the Soul Trap of Mora on many different NPC's until the "you cannot trap more than one soul at a time message" STOP and then use the WAIT (select button). Then the soul trap SHOULD work the way it was intended.... Just remember that if you mess it up again to fix it Save often ;) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 76.22.254.139 (talk • contribs).

I just tested this fix and it work perfectly for me on my PS3 version. -SkiOne

[edit] Anga

I just ran through it and didn't count, but Anga had a great variety of races among the Forgotten Ones, possibly one of each. If you're doing the Hermaeus Mora quest, you don't need to worry about failing Namira, because you would have already completed it. Is this suitable to add to the main article? --GuildKnightTalk2me 02:01, 29 December 2007 (EST)

Well, you can't quite get all ten, but you can get quite a few: the Forgotten include every race except Argonian, Dunmer, and Khajiit. Seems like it might be worth mentioning. --NepheleTalk 02:28, 29 December 2007 (EST)

[edit] PS3 Crash

(moved from the article)

  • On the PS3, the book that you receive as a reward can not be read. The game will freeze and you have to do a reboot.

I'm guessing this was just one person's experience rather than a general one. Can anybody with a PS3 confirm please? –Rpeh•T•C•E• 18:04, 14 January 2008 (EST)

I confirmed it with an xbox 360 so it works.
He's referring to PS3, not Xbox 360. Ong elvin 01:37, 14 February 2008 (EST)

Having same problem, even restarted entire quest, and redid all souls, and STILL crashing! No matter what you try to read from the book, it always crashes and you can't get out!

Yeah, i can confirm this, came on here just now to see if there was a fix.. i've tried all three options for reading, and nothing i do will unfreeze it except for rebooting. i also am on ps3 Scarer19 05:35, 19 April 2008 (EDT) sorry for the double posting, but i just found that if you assign the book to a shortcut key it works fine, without crashing. i tested it and it worked fine. Scarer19 05:44, 19 April 2008 (EDT)

[edit] Imperials and Bretons

This seems the most relevant place to ask the question - how do you distinguish Imperials and Bretons from each other? I can't see any physical differences. :/ Ong elvin 02:11, 29 January 2008 (EST)
Traditionally, Bretons have lighter skin than Imperials - about the same skin tone as Nords. Also, they are a slightly different size - although the size difference is not as perceptible in Oblivion as it was in Morrowind, it is still there. Breton females are shorter, while Breton males are slimmer, than their Imperial counterparts.
Technically, Breton males have a height-weight scale of 1.00-1.00 (the 'default'), while females are 0.95-0.90. Imperial males are 1.00-1.25, and females are 1.00-0.95.
--Gaebrial 02:32, 29 January 2008 (EST)
Voice and hairstyle is how I usually manage, although the first isn't much use until you're already in combat and the second isn't perfect either. I usually just kill bandits and marauders until I get what I need for this quest! –Rpeh•T•C•E• 02:33, 29 January 2008 (EST)
Hmm... I forgot about Nords too. Three races that look way too similar. x.x Well, at least Nord males seem to have an accent when they speak, so they're not so bad I guess. Ong elvin 04:37, 29 January 2008 (EST)

[edit] Rockmilk Cave

That's another perfect place where you can get almost all of the 10 souls. It's located on the left side of the road between Bravil and Leyawin. It's exat location is Tamriel 19, -27. Inside you'll find a bandits and marauders. lots of them. I found all 3 kinds of elves and all humans except redguard. Besides, you get to collect about 10 black bows, tons of loot, come coll magic items and watch a good clan war. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 70.67.53.202 (talk • contribs).

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