Skyrim talk:Blood on the Ice/Archive 7

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This is an archive of past Skyrim talk:Blood on the Ice discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page, except for maintenance such as updating links.
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Strange Amulet bug still present with 1.5

Just a quick note for future reference; it's still not possible to drop the strange amulet after completing the quest, even with patch 1.5 installed. --Krusty 11:53, 11 April 2012 (UTC)

Also, I have the Unofficial Skyrim Patch 1.1 installed and this did not fix the bug with the strange amulet. 71.72.122.191 00:12, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

it's not starting!... yet i think it did but not in my journal

OK I've been to windhelm a few times now and then ( got to quest liberation of skyrim: liberate the reach and compelling tribute) with out doing anything with it nor did i even know the quest existed at the time. I eventually wanted the house here since a friend suggested it as a great home (YouTube confirmed this for me it looks awesome) so i looked up how to get and it says something about a graveyard and the thing well I've been there like 4 times all at different times ranging from 10:00pm to 1:00 am and nothing but yet i hear the npc saying stuff about how some death was so unfortunate and tova shatter-sheilds says stuff about here dead daughter but i cant engage in conversation its just she says something random and that's it. I've even pick pocketed her for the key to hjerim and gone inside tried to investigate area nothing happened read the fliers taken the butchers books taken the amulet and it still didn't activate and ive talked to jarleff and he says after i try to click the buy house for 12000 gold he says "there is an empty home in the city... unpleasantness recently. i'm afraid its not available just yet." so idk what the stuff is going on here people are talking bout the deaths but i cant talk to any of them about it i'm not sure whats going on here. — Unsigned comment by 98.228.41.6 (talk) at 05:27 on April 15, 2012

Anything could be wrong with your save file, and the easiest way to test it is to fast-travel from, say, Whiterun to Windhelm and make absolutely SURE you arrive at night time (the exact times escapes me, but 1am should be fine). When you arrive, head to the graveyard and see if you find the gathering of witnesses. --Krusty 09:41, 15 April 2012 (UTC)
Try this fix-
1.) Open console by pressing ~ key then typing "setstage ms11 1" without the quotes
2.) in console type "set ms11enteringwindhelmcount to 3" in the console without quotes
3.) To verify, type "getstage ms11" without quotes in the console.It should return the value 1.
Wait outside the gates till 8-9 pm then enter windhelm.The quest should now begin normally.
117.194.36.84 12:59, 16 April 2012 (UTC) Anonymous
EDIT- im sorry but i forgot to mention that i am on the xbox360 so i cannot use console commands also i might mention that i have no current way to get internet on my xbox (i dont have a cord for the xbox or and good WiFi) so therefor i do not have any patches. — Unsigned comment by 98.228.41.6 (talk) at 19:22 on April 17, 2012
Syntax was wrong on step 2. You probably meant "set ms11enteringwindhelmcount to 3"
It did not work for me.
My character entered Windhelm first around level 38. Did a good amount of sidequests there. No NPCs dead, not even a Dragon attack that could've accidentally harmed one. Talked to Aventus Arentino, didn't do anything Dark Brotherhood-related past that. Didn't choose a side in the civil war. Checked the graveyard every night I was there. Nothing. Eventually pickpocketted the key and went inside the house. Quest didn't trigger. Reloaded the game to before I attempted this.
I finally attempted to use console commands in hope to kickstart the quest. I've tried this version, and the one that starts with "stopquest ms11preessentializing". Imputted from Winterhold, after which I fast traveled back to Windhelm, taking care to arrive around midnight. Only to find that graveyard empty as usual.
It is very confusing to me, especially considering the fact I haven't done anything wrong to my knowledge.--24.201.46.183 02:50, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
That fix actually worked for me (taking into account the syntactical error mentioned above). Step 3 returned a value of 1.0 for me, so I walked outside the city, waited until 9:00PM the next day and went back inside, and there it was! 68.186.51.237 04:11, 25 April 2012 (UTC)
The same thing didn't work for me. I typed the command consoles as seen, + Syntax error, but when I type 'getstage ms11', it gives me 0.00. I've tried all variations but it stays at 0.00 — Unsigned comment by 58.106.148.22 (talk) at 10:57 on 14 May 2012
If you've done the Dark Brotherhood quest for Muiri and killed Nilsine, Tova will be commit suicide and the quest will never start - additionally, you will never be able to setstage ms11 to 1 (it will always return 0 with the getstage command). In my case, I had to use the console to resurrect Tova (prid 0001B12C, disable, enable, kill, resurrect, moveto player), and at that point the commands above worked. The resurrection created a second copy of Tova, however, so I will have to kill her doppleganger after I finish Blood on the Ice to make sure nothing bugs out. Hope this helps.

() I couldn't get it to show a stage of 1.0 until i moved Arivanya to me. I realized she was dead so did the resurrect, disable, enable for her. Afterthat getstage ms11 showed 1.0 and quest triggered next time i went to windhelm — Unsigned comment by 174.118.132.184 (talk) at 16:17 on 10 June 2012

The quest has not started. If you look on the quest page here it confirms that many people in Windhelm will comment on the 'recent' murders. I loaded a way earlier save of the same character I'm using now, and the quest started the moment I fast traveled to Windhelm. I've tried everything I can think of with my current save for this character, and nothing. I even waited 10 days for the city to reset after a dragon attacked and killed only a guard. I don't think that would have affected this quest, but there was a guard standing over dead one and acting like the guard had been murdered even though the skeleton of the dragon was still right in from of the Palace of Kings. I've gone back and forth from Brandy-Mug Farm, fast traveled between Windhelm and Hlaalu Farm, everything. Except maybe eradicating all current available quests such as the White Phial that have anything to do with Windhelm. But surely that isn't what the actual bug is that appears to be occuring frequently with high-level characters not getting this quest right?--75.224.183.24 08:46, 30 June 2012 (UTC)
And after looking below, and I almost flipped when it occured to me that I may have missed this quest and experienced a cell reset, but that's impossible unless this game is REALLY messed up because Susanna the Wicked is still alive. I've found Calixto standing outside Candlehearth in the evening, but since the graveyard thing is scripted, there is no reason to worry if Susanna never leaves Candlehearth before her body is supposed to show up. I haven't even started the Dark Brotherhood quest with a related bug and my character is at level 56. I wonder if the problem may be Lydia. I'll try sending her back to Breezehome and walking back-and-forth between the stables and Brandly-Mug Farm again and post my results. — Unsigned comment by 75.224.183.24 (talk) at 09:07 on 30 June 2012
Hello, here is a script I wrote to launch the quest by resurrecting any required character. You have to launch it in front of the tombs in windhelm :
You have to put it in a bloodontheicefix.txt file in the same directory as Skyrim.exe, then you'll to launch it with the console with bat bloodontheicefix
Have fun :) — Unsigned comment by 78.235.163.74 (talk) at 23:15 on 26 July 2012
Good idea, but it doesn't help people using 360 or PS3 sadly. I couldn't start this quest with a level 40 character with whom everyone necessary was still running around mocking me with quest related dialogue. And yet the same character could trigger the quest around level 20 with a previous save? This game is full of unwanted surprises. Like being forced to kill your favorite dragon by people who can't possibly know he's alive, or having npc's that aren't essential yet are essential to a non-misc. quest or two for no paricular reason just commit suicide while you're off avoiding attracting dragons to their area, or the courier with Keening showing up naked in a dungeon. Good thing I already did a few things for Arniel and knew better than to touch it before talking to him. I never felt so paranoid when I was playing Oblivion. I practically expect Skyrim to 'soil' itself every time I play.--Playerseekingbugs 08:29, 27 July 2012 (UTC)

Stuck

I've tried everything I can think of to get around the Viola step of the quest. She's likely dead, as I spent about an hour trying to find her. I've tried talking to Wuunferth, but he only has the usual two conversation options. I've also tried stealing Calixto's journal, but that doesn't even trigger it the next step. I also have the "Get Assistance from Jorlief" problem where I've completed it, but it's still indicated as incomplete. I thought that Bethesda has released a patch to fix both problems, but it definitely hasn't worked for me. I play Skyrim on the PC, so I have access to the console. Is there a console command I can use to trigger the next steps? — Unsigned comment by 70.108.240.190 (talk) at 16:21 on 3 July 2012

If you think Viola is dead try saving your game, then use the console command player.moveto 0001B13C as this will physically move your character to her: either alive or as a corpse. If she is alive she might be at home, in Windhelm and so on. If she is dead you might end up in this wierd little cell where dead bodies go to rest (why a save game to get yourself out), or in the Windhelm Hall of the Dead. Good Luck. --Anubis Priest 18:24, 26 August 2012 (UTC)

Quest not triggered while all relevant NPCs are alive

Although all relevant NPCs (Arivanya, Tova, Nilsine, Viola, Wuunferth and Calixto) are alive and always have been, the quest just won't start.

Even when I pickpocket the Hjerim key from Tova and enter the house, I can pick up the journals, the Beware the Butcher flyers and read them, still nothing happens. There's "Investigate InvestigationTarget" fields everywhere in the house, however, upon triggering them nothing happens.

Upon meeting Viola, she will not give me any dialogue, just her standard one-liners. Same for Wuunferth.

Trying setstage or resetquest won't help as well, as getstage will always return 0.00.

Windhelm is under Imperial rule. No ideas left. Anyone please? — Unsigned comment by 92.75.22.162 (talk) at 00:34 on 19 July 2012

I was in the same boat until Arivanya commited suicide while I was off doing other things than try to force it to start. I've decided to finish the civil war with the imperials and see what happens. I will save at a point proir to when the Battle for Windhelm begins, then try various things to get around the two glitches that plague my high level character with this quest. Be back in a few days with results. Do you have the patches by the way? A few of them may help the yet to be understood bugs with this quest not triggering regardless of who's alive.--Playerseekingbugs 07:55, 20 July 2012 (UTC)
I completed the Battle for Windhelm, fast travelled to Whiterun to find Hadvar following me, then used the fix for that on his page to make it stop. After depositing some loot I returned to Windhelm to find it returned to exactly the same condition it was in pre-battle. So I went to Jarl Free-Winter, he gave the right to purchase land, and I went ahead and asked him about thaneship. I've apparently helped all the people I need to already, but I needed the house still, so I talked to Jorleif. The house-purchasing dialogue option was answered the typical "unpleasantness" comment, and as predicted the quest doesn't start, though whether this is due to Arivanya or the some bug with being level 65 I don't know. I'll try reloading a save before I talked to Free-Winter and then talking to Jorleif about the house before I talk to him about thaneship, and a few other thing like reloading a save just before the battle and making sure Hadvar doesn't follow me to Whiterun.--Playerseekingbugs 17:13, 21 July 2012 (UTC)
The quest only starts if you spend a night in town and wander around the graveyard, otherwise the first victim, Susanna, will remain alive at the Candlehearth Hall 82.243.194.53 21:06, 21 July 2012 (UTC)
What do you mean by spend a night in town? Do you mean rent a bed and sleep there at night for a few hours or literally wander Windhelm's graveyard area for most of a night and then leave the city proper and come back before 7:00am and the scene should trigger? The scene doesn't set up while you are in the city or one of the buildings in the city. The exception being if you are lucky enough to be able force the quest to trigger by stealing Tova's key to Hjerim and investigating. There are report of Susanna showing up in the graveyard as soon as you leave Hjerim when that happens.--Playerseekingbugs 05:23, 22 July 2012 (UTC)
Well usually I'm just wandering in town at night, talking to citizens, stealing a thing or two, and after a while the crime scene with the guard and the witnesses just spawns in the graveyard. I've never done anything special to start the quest, not even asking about past murders. 82.243.194.53 06:36, 22 July 2012 (UTC)
So you actually don't wander around the graveyard? Do you check for it as soon as you enter the city for a night of thieving, or does it seem to appear after you exit one of the houses or something? The quest is supposed to start based on a counter. Once you enter a somewhat sketchy area of land around Windhelm or possibly Windhelm itself via fast travel for the fourth or higher time between 7:00 pm and 7:00 am, the quest is supposed to trigger from the beginning by spawning the graveyard scene. If you're doing Thieves Guild quest, and you don't frequent Windhelm, then it would probably trigger after a few of those, but it never started for me regardless of whether Arivanya was alive or not. I just spent roughly two nights wandering primarily around the graveyard, then exiting and reentering Windhelm a few times after 5 am (when Calixto stops leaning against a wall behind Candlehearth and heads back home). It didn't trigger. Though I didn't try entering a few houses and stuff and wandering all around Windhelm, but that still shouldn't trigger it. Multiple people have done much testing with this, and the scene shouldn't trigger when you leave a building in Windhelm, you have to enter it from the outside (preferably the main gate or fast travel to said gate).--Playerseekingbugs 07:23, 22 July 2012 (UTC)
No, I don't pay specific attention to the graveyard at first. When I enter town, I just start a few quests, complete some misc objectives and such. However I don't know if entering the town through the Docks' gate counts toward the number of time you got to Windhelm, so we might be onto something; I usually go twice or thrice there the first time I get in town. 82.243.194.53 08:40, 22 July 2012 (UTC)

() I think that gate actually does. There's a guy on youtube who posted his method for getting the quest to start. He enters through the main gate, then exits and enters through the dock gate a few times, and the scene triggers. I tried that with my character, but it didn't work unfortunately. You're runs in and out of both entrances and possibly movements in and out of the area around Windhelm that also affects the counter is probably what causes it to appear. Especially if you're using new to fairly new characters when the quest triggers, as for unknown and infuriating reasons this becomes harder to start as your character levels and you spend more time with that character. — Unsigned comment by Playerseekingbugs (talkcontribs) at 16:59 on 22 July 2012

harder to start as your character levels... This is not the case. I ran into trouble getting the quest to trigger, and went back to earlier saves. Saves with the character at level 66 and 70 had no problem... although the 66 had only a couple quests finished, and the 70 hadn't done any of the major faction quest lines. By level 72 I had finished quite a bit more, and I think it was winning the Civil War for the Imperials that caused the roadblock. It's not that the now non-Windhelm soldier doesn't say his lines, it's that the crime scene never appears (and so the quest never starts). I'm just saying, the level aspect isn't a factor. Also, for clarity, this is on 360. --172.162.219.145 08:58, 29 July 2012 (UTC)
I think he means that its harder to start on a character you have had for a long time, as you may have already missed the triggers to start the quest. — Kimi the Elf (talk | contribs) 09:05, 29 July 2012 (UTC)
Precisely what I meant. There is something about the rather unique trigger 'mechanism' for this quest that makes it very easy to either lose Tova or Arivanya without realizing their importance to starting a quest that is capable of carrying on without them after triggering, and even then the best chance of it triggering at all is to take the first carriage you find in-game to Windhelm and use the suggested trigger method. I still can't get it to trigger with a level 40 character where the civil war quests have not been touched at all and everyone in Windhelm is alive and well. Not even a single guard has died, and still the quest refuses to trigger.--Playerseekingbugs 02:32, 30 July 2012 (UTC)
Pretty much what I figured, it's just (not to sound like a jerk) that there was a 'hands thrown in the air in despair of ever learning what causes this problem' quality to the phrasing. To that end... It may be significant that in the saves in which I could trigger the quest... at those points I had never previously visited Windhelm. So in the save I have problems with, the first trip to Windhelm was part of the Civil War quests (the axe delivery), my second visit was when I took Windhelm for the Empire, and the third/fourth when I started the Dark Brotherhood questline. I was only actively trying to start this before I got to Mourning Never Comes... and failing despite the relevant (and irrelevant) NPCs still being alive. Since I haven't done anything else Windhelm-specific, it stands to reason that whatever conflict is preventing the trigger has to do with either the Civil War or joining the Dark Brotherhood. Although when it comes to bugs in this game, "reason" can be a sketchy place to start from... --172.131.66.214 07:58, 31 July 2012 (UTC)
Indeed. I didn't realize my despair over this infuriating quest was seeping into my posts on it, but that is how I feel. This quest is a mess that either needs to die by patch or at least be given a practically guaranteed, any time dialogue trigger like many other side quests. There are very few complaints about just trying to start the quest on most side quest pages because the way you trigger it is a tried and true, realiable dialogue option or intended item pickup.--Playerseekingbugs 07:10, 1 August 2012 (UTC)
This discussion is turning into forum-like complaining, without adding anything useful to improve the article - let's kill it now, okay? --Krusty 08:05, 1 August 2012 (UTC)
In the interest of narrowing down what might cause the failure to start, I went through several old saves and compared the active/completed quests in each. I could narrow down the point of breakage to somewhere on the Imperial Legion questline (I could still trigger the graveyard scene with The Battle for Fort Dunstad completed). With all Imperial Legion quests complete, I could not get the scene to trigger. I'm playing on 360 with no patches, so I'm wondering if the "If you capture Windhelm for the Imperials" point in the bugs might only happen in a PC and/or patches scenario... when the quest fails to start, I've only ever had it fail completely; I've never been in the situation where the corpse and witnesses appear and the guard does not also appear... But if the quest can still be successfully started post-Imperial Legion questline... we can pretty much rule out named quests as culprits (the only other thing I wasn't able to eliminate was the Destruction Ritual Spell, but that seems highly unlikely). --172.130.223.208 06:33, 3 August 2012 (UTC)

() No patches? Not even the official ones? One of the official patches fixed the problem with the Imperial Legion quest line (at least half of it) - see elaboration here. --Krusty 07:07, 3 August 2012 (UTC)

No broadband, so no patches. And yeah, after I commented I delved into the talk archive and... wow, that was insightful. And looking at things from your perspective, I'm sorry I brought out a flail for this dead horse. From what I've read though, post-CW the scene still ought to trigger, just sans-Windhelm guard... so it ought to be doable through Hjerim. As I said though, I've only ever had it fail completely; the quest never unlocks and Hjerim remains 'key required'. Whether that's a function of the platform I'm playing on or is normal behavior for the unpatched game, I'm not really clear on now (not trying to whine, just saying if it's normal that would give some additional detail to what the patches fix). --172.130.96.146 06:58, 4 August 2012 (UTC)

Moved from Article

Moved from Article:

  • Calixto will stand still in the market place and not kill the NPC in front of him. He will not interact with the player or NPC in anyway. Killing the NPC in front of him is the only fix, and will not incur a bounty. Calixto will then disappear, supposedly out of Windhelm. Leave the city, re-enter and the quest marker will be set correctly. Calixto will then stand still and let you kill him without becoming hostile.
    • This bug is fixed by version 1.4 of the Official Skyrim Patch.
  • If you have completed the Imperial side of the Civil War questline, Calixto's shop will be un-accessable. To get around this, use the Wooden Bowl/Plate glitch through the wall.

Added by 90.193.147.131 on 23:44, 8 August 2012

Some of this sounds really iffy to me. First, I don't think killing the intended victim is a good idea, and I'm pretty sure doing so would get you a bounty. The part about Calixto disappearing "supposedly out of Windhelm" is somewhat vague, along with the fix given. I'm not sure if this bug was actually resolved by patch 1.4 or not, and given the fact that patch 1.4 came out in February, I think this bug and its fixes would have already been listed here by now if it was legitimate. As for the second one, Calixto's shop being inaccessible is already listed as a bug, and using a glitch to fix a bug doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. If someone wants to revert and add this back to the page, that's fine, but I figured I'd list them here for now to see if anyone else has experienced these particular bugs or can recreate them. ABCface 00:56, 9 August 2012 (UTC)

Can't kill Calixto

I spoke to Wuunerth in jail before Jorlief or the guard and the quest changed from "Patrol the Stone Quarter at Night" to "Catch the Killer". Calixto is in Hjerim but can't be killed. Blew it off, and Ulfric sold me Hjerim during Civil War quest, but now Calixto is apparently my new roommate. Hjerim is fully furnished, cleaned up and I can come and go as I please, but he is always there in the secret room. He is hostile, but after one blow he says "I knew you didn't have it in you" or some such, and goes back to wandering around.69.131.126.156 14:02, 10 August 2012 (UTC)

The "unkillable Calixto" was fixed by one of the official patches. Sounds like you proceeded to far in the quest to make it work though. --Krusty 22:31, 20 August 2012 (UTC)
If you're on PC you can try console commands to fix it. The very last part of the main article has some info on it (bug section), since aparently you can't go back quest stages you could at least set the quest to finished. I don't know if your house needs to reset and if indeed houses do reset, but as a final solution you could just try a "disable" on your unwanted roommate. Silphy 03:39, 26 August 2012 (UTC)

Mannequin Fix mod scripts blocks entering Hjerim for Quest

Yet again, I have had another problem with a character doing Blood on the Ice. This time it seems that SLuckyD's Vanilla Mannequin Script Fix version 2.0 mod is causing a problem with the mannequins in a player home that has not been upgraded yet due to the new scripts conflicting with a Skyrim update. In other words, because the mannequins are not present in the room yet (due to the decoration upgrade that allows them there not bought yet) the new mannequin scripts are causing a CTD when trying to enter the house. Upon trying to enter Hjerm to further the investigation, either by lockpicking or the key, an autosave file is created and then a CTD occurs; but the autosave file doesn't work any better than any other save.

The solution is to move the ../Data/Scripts/MannequinActivatorSCRIPT.pex script and the ../Data/Scripts/Source/MannequinActivatorSCRIPT.psc out of their folders until the upgrades for the house(s) are complete. The Backup folder works well enough. EDIT: OR go and download the 2.1 version that fixes the problem!

Just wanted to add this in here in case someone else was searching for a solution. Kudos and credit to Nexus forums user visinii for the fix. (link is to forums and the post about it)[1]

--Anubis Priest 04:08, 12 August 2012 (UTC)

Missing Guard Found!

I've run into this bug a few times on different characters. I am on Xbox360 but I found a way to take my save to PC and fix it using commands. Here's what I found and wanted to contribute:

-I used 'setstage ms11 10' which allowed me to talk to the witnesses. -After talking to the last witness I got a quest marker showing me where the guard was (outside Windhelm, oddly) -I left Windhelm via the main gate and looked at my map to see the guard's location. I had to use 'TCL', or noclip, to get to him. Oddly enough, he was standing under Windhelm (in the graveyard's location) but still outside Windhelm. -As I approached him, he started the dialog after speaking to the witnesses. So I thought... hmm... interesting.

After that, I reloaded to right before I used 'setstage' and went over to the guard and selected him, went back inside Windhelm to the graveyard, and used 'moveto player'. I then took my save back to the Xbox and completed it with no further setbacks.

Oh, before I did all this, I reloaded a save to right before I joined the Stormcloaks and tried to get the quest to start and it worked like a charm... But that was an old save and I didn't want to re-do hours of stuff I've already completed. — Unsigned comment by Ghostly150 (talkcontribs) at 18:04 on 16 August 2012

the 11 pamphlets called Beware the Butcher!

You need to take the 11 pamphlets called Beware the Butcher! from the chest to be able to continue the quest. I lost one hour trying to speak with all the people involved in this quest with no luck, unfortunately reading around here spoiled everything, but in the end I managed to understand what my problem was. So, after entering the house where the clues are, I took the amulet, the journals, got the clues message but I didn't took the pamphlets. It was a minor slip, but if you didn't read or probably take one with you, Viola Giordano will not speak with you and you can't continue the quest.

Hope it helps. Doru 11:14, 22 August 2012 (UTC)

Yes, the article says to take one of the pamphlets at the end of this section. ABCface 13:51, 22 August 2012 (UTC)
Missed that :) sorry Doru 17:48, 22 August 2012 (UTC)
Not a problem, this is one of those quests which can be a pain, and it's easy to miss every little specific detail which may be needed to actually get through this with no issues! ABCface 17:58, 22 August 2012 (UTC)

Civil War actions affecting graveyard scene?

i have been trying to get the house in windhelm but the people wont show up in the grave yard. is it because i took over windhelm as a imperial? — Unsigned comment by 173.71.174.25 (talk) at 16:38 on 22 August 2012

There should be a new Imperial guard to trigger the scene due to an update to fix it. However, this quest is one of the most demanding of game "exactness" and parameters (in my opinion): there is a sizeable list of NPCs that must be alive for the whole quest to work from start to finish; you have to know to check the graveyard every time you enter Windhelm at night since it could trigger whenever; my first character seen the body and ignored it so long I had to PC console command it to start; and so much more. If you did the Dark Brotherhood quest line (a contract from Nazir) you will have one dead NPC that stalls the quest: it won't even start. Plus, I once had a vital NPC get killed by a dragon attack in Windhelm and knew right away: I had to go back to an auto save minutes before the attack. Try reading the discussions archives for ideas: Good Luck. --Anubis Priest 18:17, 26 August 2012 (UTC)
All of this is covered on the article, starting here. The civil war stuff is covered in the bugs section. --Krusty 18:57, 26 August 2012 (UTC)

Fixed!

I used the instructions that said to enable, resurrect, and resetAI on both Nilsine and Tova. This has finally let me start the quest! — Unsigned comment by 98.239.180.143 (talk) at 21:16 on 26 August 2012

Thanks for the verification. I'll go ahead and remove the 'verification needed' tag. ABCface 21:18, 26 August 2012 (UTC)

Docks works, too

When you enter the city via fast travel before 7 pm, it also works to visit the docks, and return after 7 pm. This works admirably for starting the Scouts-Many-Marshes quest, as he's coming up from the docks around then.
--DayDreamer 03:44, 27 August 2012 (UTC)


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