Daggerfall:Leveling and Skills

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The skill system is the very heart of the very well designed character creation system of the game. This page will help you understand how to make the best of increasing skills and gaining levels.

Contents 1 Maximizing Leveling Points 2 Leveling Equation 3 Leveling Suggestions 4 Practicing Spells 5 Making the Most of Training 6 Cheapest Spells to Make 6.1 List of the cheapest spells 6.2 Much cheaper spells 6.3 Free spells 7 Increasing Skill Methods 7.1 The Conventional Way 7.2 Kinda Cheating 7.3 Really Cheating 8 Guild Training Skills

[edit] Maximizing Leveling Points

Save your game before resting. If you gain a level, and got less than the maximum 6 bonus points to distribute, or less than your maximum HP/level, reload your game and rest again. This maximizes the benefits of levelling and allows you to get the best out of your character.

The larger the range of possible HP/level, the less likely it is that both that maximum and the 6 bonus attribute points are gained. The attribute points are usually much more important, so how many reloads of that save game are worth the trouble to gain the maximum in both attributes and HP is an issue best left to the player.

[edit] Leveling Equation

Level is determined by an algebraic equation:

      INT((A - B + 28)/15) = level

 	where  A = Three Primary Skills + Two Highest Major Skills + Highest Minor Skill
	       B = the starting value of these same skills
               INT = "drop any remainder"

In simpler terms, you must raise the total of these skills by 15 points in order to get a level increase. Any combination of skill increases will work as long as they total to 15 points. Increases in Miscellaneous skills do not count toward level increases, although the character will still be better at doing those things. Note that the formula counts only the highest Minor skill and the two highest Major skills, so any increases of the other Major/Minor skills do not count toward a level increase until the lower skills reach the same value as the highest.

The 28 points is a quasi-gift from the development team. 15 points of it is necessary since a new character would otherwise have to have 15 skill increases to reach 1st level. The other 13 points means that a new character only needs two skill increases to reach 2nd level.

A level increase happens after resting. At that point the game looks at the various counters and decides whether a level increase is appropriate or not.

Skill increases work a bit differently. The game tracks how often you use each skill and increments a counter with each check of the skill. The game apparently does not care whether the skill use was successful or not (aborted spells count for skill increases just like cast spells, for example); it just counts skill checks. When the counter reaches the appropriate point, a skill increases is awarded. The "appropriate point" is a combination of the current skill level and the setting of the "Difficulty Dagger" at character creation.

Skills operate under the idea that "the more you know, the harder it is to learn something new". Consequently, the number of skill checks required to gain a skill increase goes up with the skill level. This seems to be in increments of 15%. While the skill is below 15%, very few checks are necessary. It takes a few more checks when the skill is between 15% and 30%, a few more when the skill is between 30% and 45%, and so forth.

The number of required skill checks is also affected by the "Difficulty Dagger". The required number of checks is multiplied by the Dagger setting at character creation (somewhere between 0.3 and 3.0). At 1.0 and with the skill between 30 and 45, about 30 skill checks are required to gain a skill increase.

While level increases happen only after resting, skill increases happen after resting or loitering. However, at least six hours (game time) must have passed since the last time an increase was awarded for that skill.

After each increase in skill level the counter resets to zero and the process starts over. Once you reach 50% in a skill, you can no longer receive training and must increase your skill through use or magical means.

[edit] Leveling Suggestions

Some people find leveling difficult since the system used in Daggerfall is not the traditional experience based system, but a skill based one.

More Leveling Suggestions
You missed the best training tip. If you've got a wad of cash and want to take full advantage of training (especially if you started with low magic skills) you need to combine a few of the hints you gave as follows:

Using this method you can quickly increase two different skills quickly. It works best at lower levels when training is cheap. I know its slow and boring but it works. It is especially good for lockpick and magic skills which are almost useless at low levels. Also I find it best to visit the Mages Guild after dark as there are no citizens wandering about to slow down your computer.

[edit] Practicing Spells

First, make a spell for each school that uses the least amount of magika. Be sure to set target to greater than caster only or else this will not work. Good ones seem to be Silence - Mystic; Heal Attribute - Restoration; Light - Illusion; Pacify - Tham.; and Cause Damage - Destruction. You can also use the "$spell- name" trick to get 1/4 casting cost. The point is you want to be able to do this each time you rest, even if you only have about 20-30 sp left. Then cast the spell. The screen will ask you to click screen to cast. Instead push e or whatever to cancel the spell. You get the sp back, but it still counts as spell practice. Think of it as playing with the magic energies, meditating and becoming in tune with the forces involved. Or not, just hike them with DF-EDIT. One problem, I cannot get this to work with alteration magics. I've tried Free Action, Paralysis, and Elemental Resistance. None of them raise Alteration skill with this method. Also, sorry you can't make a spell to practice three of the schools at one time. I tried to save myself some time, but it didn't work. I wonder if you get any practice if you use them normally?

I use a similar method to improve my spell casting skills at times as although I have spells I don't use them too frequently and as such they rarely improve. I use jumping for practicing alteration, heal fatigue/health for restoration and open for mystical (the only spell groups I have). I have created a custom spell with minimal spell point cost for each of these. After some time I was capable of creating a spell with multiple components to practice several times at once. For example, one of my practice spells is

	Heal Health (1 + 1/level)
	Heal Fatigue (1 + 1/level)
	Jump (1 + 3/level)'

At level 18 and relatively high spell skills this costs only 6 spell points and it practices restoration twice and alteration once (I've checked). I also have a practice restoration spell

	Heal Health (1 + 1/level)
	Heal Health (1 + 1/level)
	Heal Fatigue (1 + 1/level)

Not only is a useful practice spell but a very useful spell at my level for healing damage and fatigue in battle at minimal cost.

If you develop spells with low levels (ie 1 - 2 points heal + 1 - 2 points per level) and triple this in the spell it costs less to cast than if you define 3 - 6 points heal + 3 - 6 points per level. Also it gives you three hits in leveling each cast. Spells like water breathing, walking, and light seem to be additive with multiple castings (ie a 1 round + 1 per level cast three times seems to hang around as if it were 3 round + 3 per level) this does not seem to be true for resist, absorb and reflect spells.

The $ and ! tricks do not work in version 1.7.213. You *can* mix spell schools. Pick Spell Absorption as an ability (or just do the Mage Guild quests that involve guarding the tranced mage or picking up scholarly work until you can make/buy an Spell Absorption item), then go to the Spell Maker. Pick Area at Range, then make a Damage Fatigue effect, and then add either Heal Fatigue, Light, Water Breathing, Water Walking, or Silence. It may take most/all of your mana to cast it, but if you stand near a wall, facing the wall, and cast one of the three spells (it'll take 3 such spells to cover all the schools, with much overlap in Destruction - poor baby, is your Ultimate Annihilation Sphere the cheapest spell you have to cast? so sad...) at the wall. You get practice in 3 spell schools, and all your mana back.

Does this work on .213? I just re-installed the game two days ago after a long absence (college and all), and, since then, I've built a character from 1st to 30th or so level. Yay me, with 95-100% in all schools.

PS - If you arrange your abilities right, since the game checks your primaries, then the 2 best majors, and the one best minor, your 6 dominant level-guiding abilities can just so happen to be the six schools. And if you take Spell Absorption, you can take critical weakness to Magicka, Fire, Frost, Shock, and maybe even Poison, and then take Regeneration General and Immunity to Paralysis in addition to Spell Absorption, and be nigh-invulnerable. "I am mighty!"

When creating own spells, create two spells, consisting of three other each, representing 6 schools of magic. Make them 'area at range'. When done, choose the nearest wall and fire the spell against it. The spell will be cast and reflected, the absorbed, so there'll be no mana lost. You can do this as much as you want, but 20-30 times should be enough. Then loiter about 3 hours and do it again. You can gain the 10th level by 25 minutes of playing. There's only one thing: some schools of magic do not go together, i.e. you cannot put them into one spell. The right combination is:

[edit] Making the Most of Training

The amount you pay for training is purely dependent on your level. So while you are a low-level character, spend some time at a Fighters Guild, training in all your non level-critical skills. Its not cheating, just careful training. Basically it makes for a good all-round character before you specialize.

The Fighter trainer requires you sleep for 8 hours before coming back for more. However, there is an occasional bug where you can sleep on your feet, and wake up still facing the trainer. This makes it a cinch to rocket up your miscellaneous skills. Great when it works.

When you get a mage guild quest that requires a trip somewhere else, visit the guild trainer before leaving. This way you gain the skill while traveling to your destination rather than having to rest up in an inn.

Train at the guild. Loiter 9 hours. Then you're able to train again. Do this until you're out of stamina. Then cast all your heal stamina spells. Then continue training and loitering. This way you're able to train many times without even leaving the guild. In the fighters guild you can sleep for nine hours in stead of loitering 3 times 3 hours which makes it even easier.

[edit] Cheapest Spells to Make

[edit] List of the cheapest spells

The following is a list of the cheapest spells to create in each spell school, using the $spellname cheat to reduce the casting cost by 1/4 (does not work any longer with 2.13). Please note that the spell's cost may vary depending on the character's level and his/her proficiency in each of the spell schools.

Cheapest spell for each school.

Cost	School	Spell
1	Alteration	Jumping (tie)
1	Alteration	Water Breathing (tie)
?	Destruction	Minimal Damage Health Spell
2	Illusion	Light
5	Mysticism	Open
1	Restoration	Free Action
1	Thaumaturgy	Water Walking

A very efficient way to progress in magic skills is to create a spell with three effects (three is the max anyway) including one that requires a target. Indeed, the skill roll is done BEFORE the targeting but the spell points are spent AFTER. The only spell in this list which requires a target is the Destruction spell. Chose the first effect to be a Destruction spell: that way, you will have to target in order to really cast the spell (spend the spell points). Then, for the two other effects, chose some from any other schools you want your character to make progress in (say Illusion-Light and Thaumaturgy-Water walking). The training consists in casting-canceling-casting-canceling again and again, without targeting, no spell point is spent but many skill rolls are done, and therefore your character will progress in those three skills next time he rests.

[edit] Much cheaper spells

To reduce the cost of the spell much more, don't forget to change the per level value: instead of

1-1 + 1-1 per 1 level

create the spell like this:

1-1 + 1-1 per 2 levels

Spells that are x-y, where x is an odd number and y is the following even number will cost the same as an x-x spell. This applies to all variable fields. At low levels, this makes very little difference, but at mid- and upper- levels, it can be a significant advantage.

[edit] Free spells

You can train without losing a single Magicka Point. Create a multi-effect spell, for example :

Water walking
Water breathing
Damage health

1. Cast the spell. The skills thaumaturgie, alteration and destruction are used and your MP decrease. Because Damage health awaits a target, the spell is cast but not triggered. Do not select any target.
2. Cancel the spell (press e). Your MP returns to where it was before attempting to cast the spell.
3. Recast the spell (press q to quick-cast the last spell cast).
4. If not enough then go to 2.
5. Rest.

However, this will only train the skill associated with the first spell effect.

Another method of getting free spells is to have the ability (preferably an item or starting advantage) to absorb magicka. This is automatically given to a sorcerer, so this is one way to train all 6 schools of magicka for free!

• First you have to be a member of the Mages Guild. Any rank will do.

• Go to the Spell Maker and get ready to make some great training spells for cheap (cheap gold, free casting cost) but effective training.

• Once in the spell maker, add the spell 'fireball' with '1-1 + 1-1 per 2' level stats. Set to 'area around target' (basically a blast) and fire as the element.

• Add in the next two effects from two other schools. Name the spells something like 'training D##' (the ## being the first letter of the other two schools) (note: Since you want an area around target destruction spell (like fireball) in all spells, you will need 3 training spells with one school getting an extra boost (excluding destruction))

Make sure all the training spells have that weak fireball spell as first with a 'absorb magicka' ability. Here are my personal training spells:

• Name: training DIR, Spells: Fireball 1-1 + 1-1 per 2 levels (area around target, fire), Light 1-1 + 1-1 per 2 levels, Free Action 1-1 + 1-1 per 2 levels

• Name: training DMA, Spells: Fireball 1-1 + 1-1 per 2 levels (area around target, fire), Silence 1-1 + 1-1 per 2 levels, Water Breathing 1-1 + 1-1 per 2 levels

• Name: training DTA, Spells: Fireball 1-1 + 1-1 per 2 levels (area around target, fire), Water Walking 1-1 + 1-1 per 2 levels, Water Breathing 1-1 + 1-1 per 2 levels (I have two spells containing alteration. The last school can be changed to what you want trained. I suggest it be one that is not in the 'misc.' category since it doesn't affect your leveling.)

Cast this near a wall or at your feet so you gain the magicka you just used. These are only training spells, and are supposed to cost as little as possible for maximum use from almost any amount of magicka. I suggest that you DO NOT use these against human enemies (knights, guards, thieves, etc.) since they can only deal a small amount of damage.

[edit] Increasing Skill Methods

You want to get 100 points in everything? Well, under the game's normal progression, you will eventually get there, but it will take a long time. Here are some pointers.

[edit] The Conventional Way

Train and practice as much as you can. Every time you get a guild quest, use the trainer before you leave. Do this when you're at low level so the cost (100*level) is less. Jump around town. Use up all your spell points before you rest. Don't go through the city's gates, climb the wall. Climb houses too. Run around town, don't use the horse. Go to a province you know you'll never return to and just run around town picking everyone's pockets. Sneak around dungeons. Run around the town at night and try to pick the locks of every door you see. Try speaking to monsters (you'll have to sheathe your weapon) whose language you can study. Sell items one at a time to a shopkeeper to increase the mercantile skill. Go swimming for awhile, just don't run out of air! Etc, etc. As the manual says, you can only get better in stuff you constantly use. I used this method for my first four characters.

[edit] Kinda Cheating

Then there are ways to kinda cheat. Combine several weak spells from each area of study in the spell maker and keep casting/resting. Go void ranging and pick all the monsters off with your bow to increase the archery skill. Stand still when fighting weak monsters like rats to give your dodging skill a boost. Pick monsters pockets. Cast levitate move forward and hold run and jump down when you're in a house with a low ceiling. While swimming, save the game just before you run out of air and then restore the same save; you'll have a new supply of air and can keep working on the skill! Talk to anyone that can repair items and just hit the repair button; it'll say zero gold hit OK and repeat the process for your mercantile skill to go up. There are others yet to be found. Some would say that this is outright cheating. I say that if the game lets you do it, then it ain't cheating! I used this with my fifth and possibly sixth characters because I got tired of starting over with a fresh character when the main quests got screwed up.

[edit] Really Cheating

Go to any Daggerfall web page that has a file library and pick up DF-edit. It's a utility that allows you to change all your skills to whatever you want them to be. The only time I personally use it is to avoid starting the game over from level 1 due to Bethesda's negligence. I bump all my stats to what they were before the game crashed/halted/screwed up/cheated/boned me/etc. Then I only have to start the main quests over from the beginning. Beware. The game is no fun if you give yourself 100 in everything without earning it. Do yourself the favor and let your character develop the same way you would in real life; with hard work and patience!

[edit] Guild Training Skills

The following is a list of all the skills along with which guild you can practice them in.

Skill	Guilds Where Skill can be Trained
Alteration	Mage, Akatosh, Julianos
Archery	Fighters, Kynareth, Mara, Akatosh, Dark Brotherhood
Axe	Fighters, Arkay, Stendarr
Backstabbing	Arkay, Thief, Dark Brotherhood
Blunt Weapon	Fighters, Stendarr, Thief, Zenithar
Centaurian	Zenithar
Climbing	Kynareth, Arkay, Thief, Dark Brotherhood
Critical Strike	Stendarr, Fighters, Mara, Arkay, Dark Brotherhood, Julianos
Daedric	Dibella, Mage, Kynareth, Stendarr, Akatosh, Mara, Dark Brotherhood, Zenithar, Julianos
Destruction	Kynareth, Mage, Akatosh, Arkay, Dark Brotherhood
Dodging	Kynareth, Stendarr, Thief, Dark Brotherhood
Dragonish	Akatosh, Mage, Kynareth
Etiquette	Dibella, Mara, Zenithar
Giantish	Fighters, Zenithar
Hand to Hand	None
Harpy	Dibella, Mage, Mara, Kynareth, Zenithar
Illusion	Kynareth, Mage, Dibella, Mara
Impish	Mage, Julianos
Jumping	Fighters, Thief
Lockpicking	Dibella, Thief, Julianos
Longblade	Dibella, Akatosh, Fighters
Medical	Arkay, Mara, Stendarr
Mercantile	Zenithar, Julianos
Mysticism	Mage, Julianos
Nymph	Dibella, Mara
Orcish	Stendarr, Dibella, Fighters, Mage, Zenithar
Pickpocket	Thief, Zenithar
Restoration	Dibella, Mage, Stendarr, Arkay, Mara
Running	Akatosh, Fighters, Kynareth, Dark Brotherhood
Short Blade	Fighters, Arkay, Thief, Dark Brotherhood, Julianos
Spriggan	Stendarr, Mage, Zenithar
Stealth	Kynareth, Akatosh, Thief, Dark Brotherhood
Streetwise	Dibella, Mara, Thief, Dark Brotherhood, Zenithar
Swimming	Fighters, Akatosh, Thief, Dark Brotherhood
Thaumaturgy	Mage, Zenithar, Julianos